Northern Ireland Assembly, 28 September 2010

285 contributions from 63 members. The official report.

Assembly Business

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

Before we move to the business on the Order Paper, I advise the House that the Minister of Health, Social Services and Public Safety will make a personal statement immediately after the ministerial statement on the September monitoring rounds. I caution the House that I will not take any points of order on this matter. We will now move on to today’s business.

Maurice (DUP, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

On a point of order, Mr Speaker.

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

Order. I am not prepared to take any points of order on what I said. I am informing the House that the Minister of Health, Social Services and Public Safety will be in the House to make a personal statement after the Minister of Finance and Personnel has spoken on the September monitoring rounds. I will take a point of order that is outside that particular issue.

Maurice (DUP, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

My point of order is about future statements to the House. This could refer to any Member, although I suspect that it would apply only to a Minister. Whenever a Minister is going to make a statement in the House, do they give you a time when they will make that statement? If not, perhaps you could look at that again with the Chairperson of the Committee on Procedures so that the House can be helped in its business and, more importantly, so that you can be helped and so that we can have some indication about when those statements are coming, particularly personal statements from a given Minister.

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

I hear very much what Lord Morrow said. Personal statements must be cleared by the Speaker. I have received the personal statement. I take a great deal of time with personal statements to make sure that they say what they need to say. Of course, we then need time to inform Whips of the issue. That is why I have decided that the statement should be heard at 12.00 noon today, or in and around that time, after the statement from the Finance Minister. Lord Morrow raised an interesting point yesterday about the Committee on Procedures, and it is an issue that the Committee on Procedures should look at.

I will take no further points of order on the issue. I took a point of order from Lord Morrow, and that is the only one that I will take. I am moving on.

Peter Weir (DUP, North Down)

On a point of order, Mr Speaker.

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

I am taking no further points of order on the issue. The issue was well aired yesterday, and I allowed quite a number of Members in on it. I have allowed Lord Morrow in on it this morning, and it should rest there. I have made it clear to the House when the Minister will be here.

I remind Members that part of the convention on personal statements is that they must be heard in silence. Yesterday, I gave some latitude to Members, but this morning is when it stops. I am moving on to the business on the Order Paper for this morning.

Peter Weir (DUP, North Down)

Further to that point of order, Mr Speaker, I am seeking clarification on the way that things will be handled. I am not in any way challenging your authority.

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

I am happy to see the Member or any other Member outside the House to discuss how the issue has been handled.

Peter Weir (DUP, North Down)

My question is potentially for the benefit of the House. After this statement or any personal statement is made, does anyone have the right to respond? If so, who? Is there an opportunity to question a Minister on his or her personal statement?

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

No. A personal statement is a personal statement. It should be heard in silence, and there should be no points of order or debate on it.

Unfortunately, Mrs Foster, who asked the original question, will not be in the House, so no other Member — [Interruption.] Order. The convention is clear: no other Member can question the Minister on the statement. Mrs Foster has informed me that, unfortunately, she will not be in the House for the statement. The convention is that no other Member of her party is allowed to rise in her place.

Maurice (DUP, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

Could Mrs Foster delegate the Chief Whip of her party to ask a question?

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

No. I am going to move on. There is a clear convention in the House. We should now move on.

Ministerial Statements

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

I have received notice from the Minister of Agriculture and Rural Development that she wishes to make a statement.

Michelle Gildernew (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

Go raibh míle maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle. With your permission, I wish to make a statement in compliance with section 52 of the NI Act 1998, regarding the recent meeting of the North/South Ministerial Council (NSMC) in aquaculture and marine sectoral format.

The meeting was held at the NSMC joint secretariat offices in Armagh on Thursday 9 September 2010. The Executive were represented by Robin Newton and myself; the Irish Government were represented by the Minister for Communications, Energy and Natural Resources, Eamon Ryan TD. The statement has been agreed with junior Minister Newton, and I am making it on behalf of us both.

The Council welcomed a progress report on the work of the Loughs Agency, which was presented by its chairperson, Tarlach O Crosain, and chief executive, Derick Anderson. Ministers welcomed the developing partnerships on marine tourism between the Loughs Agency, NITB and Louth County Council.

We noted the effectiveness of the agency’s response to pollution incidents on the Foyle system through the use of aeration and pollution prevention equipment. We also noted the positive impact of the regulation of the Lough Foyle oyster fishery, including improved catches in the 2009-2010 season. Ministers also noted that the agency’s new monitoring vessel, the MMV Ostrea, is operational and has facilitated the surveying of the seed mussel areas in Carlingford Lough and the native oyster fishery in Lough Foyle.

The Loughs Agency also reported that there has been an increase in illegal salmon poaching, and Ministers were concerned to hear that there have been violent confrontations between poachers and Loughs Agency staff. A number of prosecutions are pending for both illegal fishing and assaults on Loughs Agency staff.

The Council welcomed a presentation by the Loughs Agency on the 2010 series of catchment status reports, which are produced in-house by Loughs Agency staff. Ministers were impressed by the user-friendly format of the reports, the range of information presented and how that information is made widely available to the agency’s stakeholders and other interested parties through the agency’s website. We also noted the practical use of this information and how it is applied by the Loughs Agency to ensure continued and effective conservation and protection of the freshwater fisheries and aquatic resources of the Foyle and Carlingford systems, whether on the basis of a localised plan or complementary to the implementation of the water framework directive throughout Ireland.

The Council approved a set of regulations which reduce the fee charged for an oyster fishing licence in Lough Foyle from £300 or €400 to £150 or €166. Ministers were pleased that the agency’s stakeholders will benefit financially through the introduction of those regulations, particularly in the current economic climate.

Ministers considered the agency’s legislation implementation plan, welcomed progress in its delivery and noted that further regulations will require NSMC approval during 2010 and 2011.

Ministers noted the Loughs Agency’s annual report and draft financial statements for 2009, which will be laid before the Assembly and the Oireachtas once the financial statements have been certified by the respective Comptrollers and Auditors General.

Finally, we agreed that the next meeting in the aquaculture and marine sectoral format will take place in December 2010.

Stephen Moutray (DUP, Upper Bann)

I thank the Minister for bringing this statement to the House.

I condemn the assaults on Loughs Agency staff carrying out their legitimate duties. I am delighted that the agency is pursuing those and the illegal poaching of fish through the courts.

I note that the Minister mentioned the developing partnerships between the Loughs Agency, NI Tourist Board and Louth County Council on marine tourism. Will the Minister also advise the House whether the degeneration of partnerships between the agency, the Department and the local fishermen was discussed at the meeting? Will she also advise of the final cost of the MMV Ostrea, how long the vessel was non-operational and the cause of its being non-operational?

Michelle Gildernew (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

I welcome the Chairperson’s comments on the assaults on staff. It is important that we send a message that the House is united behind the Loughs Agency staff and the work they are doing. We were concerned to hear that staff had been subjected to violent confrontations. The chief executive reported at the meeting that, where appropriate, the PSNI and guards had been called and that prosecutions are pending. As the accompanying Minister said at the meeting, this is not a victimless crime, and we expressed concern for the welfare of staff. We heard that among the items seized was an air rifle. Some of the charges brought have resulted in custodial sentences. It may also be of interest to the Committee that agency staff had been involved in removing bodies from the river and that the agency is sourcing counselling services for its staff, in the event that they are needed.

As to the Chairperson’s second question, on partnerships, a lot of work has been carried out in partnership with NITB, the Loughs Agency and Louth County Council. For example, projects at Mill Bay and Narrow Water are now under way. We are content that those partnerships are in place and that stakeholders generally work very well with the Loughs Agency. The fishermen recognise that the regulations developed under the auspices of the NSMC over a period of years have resulted in more sustainable angling on the Foyle, and many Members of the House and many members of the community have remarked on the benefits to tourism in an area that has been hard hit by the economic climate. We are all aware of the loss of the Seagate factory at Limavady and other big job losses. Tourism is becoming increasingly important, and it is hugely important that the agency works with partners.

As to the MMV Ostrea, I can confirm that the cost of the vessel has been in the region of £830,000. There had been some issues at the beginning, but those have been resolved successfully. The MMV Ostrea has a clean bill of health and, now that it is operational, it has carried out survey work and has returned useful information. I am confident that the vessel will be useful. It will greatly assist in the provision of scientific management of the stocks in the Foyle and Carlingford in order to facilitate the development and sustainability of those sectors.

Barry McElduff (Sinn Féin, West Tyrone)

Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle. The Minister spoke of developing partnerships between the Loughs Agency, the NI Tourist Board and Louth County Council. Might there be scope for other such partnerships under the North/South Ministerial Council, whereby communities north and south of the border could connect to ensure that the maximum amenity of leisure provision and community regeneration is recognised? I am thinking particularly of the tremendous potential of Lough Macrory in County Tyrone. Perhaps a suitable partner from south of the border could be found through the NSMC when it next meets in this format.

Michelle Gildernew (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

I expected some latitude and creativity in Members’ questions, but I did not expect it in the second one. However, I welcome the Member’s question. It is unfortunate that Lough Macrory is outside the remit of the Loughs Agency, which is the Carlingford and Foyle catchment area, although I know that the Member is very aware of the geography of the area. However, his point is a serious one: communities could come together under the auspices of the Loughs Agency and create those linkages and partnerships. That can work, and we will certainly look into that.

Major projects using funds secured under the INTERREG programmes, for example, are set to take place at Gribben Quay, the Foyle Pontoon and at Meadowbank Quay. Those have been successful and important for the regeneration of the area. I do not see a problem if community organisations that do not fall under the auspices of the Foyle can create links in order to meet one another and find ways that they can tap into funding. However, that is technically outside the reach of the Foyle and Carlingford areas.

George Savage (UUP, Upper Bann)

I thank the Minister for her statement. As usual, she has highlighted something that I am concerned about: the poaching of salmon. What is the Department doing to help encourage and promote angling activities across loughs and rivers in Northern Ireland?

Michelle Gildernew (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

The Member is aware that the Department of Culture, Arts and Leisure is the key agency that deals with coarse and inland waterway fishing. The Loughs Agency is responsible for the Foyle and Carlingford catchment areas and to that end has worked hard with our fishing stakeholders. A management system is now in place whereby, if fish counters are not recording adequate numbers of salmon, a temporary restriction can be placed on other types of fishing to ensure the retention of salmon in those rivers. It is important that the correct management tools are used; that the information is available to the Loughs Agency to make those decisions; and that there is sustainability of fishing in that area. However, there are other areas outside of the control of the Loughs Agency.

We hear about Atlantic survival and the rates of fish returning to an area. The research work that Loughs Agency staff have done has been hugely informative and interesting. It states that fish traditionally come back to the same river. There is a specific gene in the fish that can identify the River Faughan or the River Roe, which is fascinating. We are looking at ways in which we can ensure the safety and spawning ability of fish when they are in our rivers. The unknown factor in that is that we do not know when they will come back, so we have to monitor fish levels in our rivers carefully and ensure that they are not overfished. Concerns over the sustainability of coarse fishing have been raised with the Culture Minister, but again, that is outside the remit of the NSMC aquaculture sector.

P J Bradley (Social Democratic and Labour Party, South Down)

I thank the Minister for her statement. She stated that the agency’s new monitoring vessel, the MMV Ostrea, is now operational and has facilitated the surveying of the seed mussel areas in Carlingford Lough. In early summer, I wrote to the Minister with regard to the threat of disease to the mussel stock of Carlingford Lough. A fear was expressed to me that North/South co-operation was not all that it could have been. Was there any discussion on the very serious disease threat in Carlingford Lough?

Michelle Gildernew (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

I assure the Member that we are doing everything that we can to identify possible disease outbreaks in the Foyle and Carlingford catchments and disease at any level, whether animal, plant or fish. We take the threat of disease very seriously. I assure the Member that my Department has an excellent working relationship with DAFF. Work is being done to ensure that we have proper controls to mitigate disease outbreaks. There is full co-operation. As the Member pointed out, if there was no North/South co-operation in Carlingford Lough, there would not be any kind of activity there, as it divides the two jurisdictions. Co-operation is absolutely necessary. I assure the Member that all is being done to contain every kind of disease, to ensure that proper scientific studies are done on those and to develop a sustainable fishery in the Carlingford area.

Kieran McCarthy (Alliance, Strangford)

I thank the Minister for her statement, in which she said that the Council approved regulations that reduced the fee from some €400 to €166. That is certainly a hell of a reduction in the fee, and I have no doubt that the stakeholders will be pleased. Surely, however, that size of reduction must leave a gap somewhere else in the system? Will the Minister explain how she will fill that gap?

Michelle Gildernew (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

When the regulation was set down, thought was given to how many licences would be issued. The number of licences has stabilised over the past number of years, and about twice as many licences as were expected have now been issued. To make it more affordable and yet to still cover our administrative costs in delivering the licences, it was decided that the fee would be reduced.

The agency has been very proactive. Rather than accepting a windfall, it identified the number of licences issued year on year and the amount of money that it expected to receive, and it decided that there was no need to charge stakeholders double the fee. There is not a gap as such; the agency has received the amount of money for which it hoped. More than that amount has been coming in over the past number of years, so it was decided to scale that back. If the number of licences remains on the current plateau, our fees will be covered, and we will not ask fishermen to dig deeper into their pockets than they need to.

Francie Molloy (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

I thank the Minister for her statement. It is an important statement, particularly as regards the link between the two jurisdictions. Is there any indication of how beneficial salmon fishing has been to the tourism industry in the past year?

Michelle Gildernew (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

There is a figure for the economic benefit of every fish that is caught. I do not have that with me, but I am happy to provide that to the Member in writing.

John Dallat (Social Democratic and Labour Party, East Londonderry)

I return briefly to the issue of partnerships. I envy the partnership between the North and County Louth. I am sure that the Minister and the House will agree that there is enormous potential in the Foyle and Bann areas of the north-west for partnerships with Inishowen, where the future of the ferry service is in some doubt because of financial difficulties. Will the Minister assure us that, in future meetings, there will be a focus on that area? As she said this morning, there has been high unemployment in Limavady, but there is enormous potential for tourism development, particularly marine tourism.

Michelle Gildernew (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

I welcome the Member’s question, but I probably cannot give him the full assurances that he is looking for today because, although the NSMC meetings in aquaculture and marine sectoral format take place regularly, the Council discusses the areas for which it has responsibility. The ferry is outside the Loughs Agency’s control and responsibility. Therefore, the matter has not been discussed at those meetings. The ferry remains under the auspices of the Department that has responsibility for it.

We recognise the importance of partnerships. As I said to Mr McElduff, we recognise the importance of working together. We have identified and shown that we work not just with tourism agencies but, as Members have witnessed, with bodies such as Louth County Council. We welcome any further partnership working that enhances the overall economic well-being of the areas under discussion. The chief executive of the Loughs Agency, Derick Anderson, and its chairperson, Tarlach O Crosain, are always proactive, but they are bound by their responsibilities.

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

I have received notice from the Minister of Finance and Personnel that he wishes to make a statement.

Sammy Wilson (DUP, East Antrim)

Thank you, Mr Speaker, for the opportunity to update the Assembly on the outcome of the September monitoring process.

The starting point for this monitoring round was the outcome of the June monitoring round, which I reported on earlier this month. Members will be aware that June monitoring concluded with an effective overcommitment of £45·1 million in current expenditure and £10·6 million in capital investment. That overcommitment was a direct result of the £127·8 million reduction in funding that the UK Government imposed in the June Budget. Although the Executive have the option of deferring our share of the UK Government’s public expenditure reduction until the next financial year, I am of the strong view that we need to deal with it now. The key issue is that, in the 2010 UK spending review, we will see a further tightening in the public expenditure environment, and we cannot allow that 2010-11 pressure to extend into the next financial year. In the September monitoring round, therefore, the Executive’s focus has been on managing down the overcommitment, as opposed to meeting a substantial number of bids from Departments.

Before I go on to the outcome of September monitoring, I will highlight the level of reduced requirements surrendered and the bids that Departments submitted. Departments surrendered only £7·7 million of current expenditure and £18·1 million of capital investment in reduced requirements respectively. At this point in recent financial cycles, that is the lowest level of reduced requirements. Details of those reduced requirements are set out in the tables attached to the written version of my statement.

Three other issues that impacted on the resources available during this monitoring round also came to light. First, a recalculation of the interest requirement to service our reinvestment and reform initiative (RRI) borrowing resulted in a further £2·8 million of current expenditure being made available. Secondly, the latest regional rate collection projection, which Land and Property Services (LPS) conducted, showed a significant increase on the June position. That partly resulted from the extra money allocated to LPS in the June monitoring round. Given that latest assessment, a further £10·6 million has been made available. Finally, June monitoring identified a pressure related to a shortfall in our end-year flexibility (EYF) capital stock. However, after further negotiation with the Treasury, my officials have secured full access to our EYF claim for this financial year, and that frees up another £7·3 million of current expenditure and £900,000 of capital expenditure.

In addition to the reduced requirements, the Executive allow Departments to move resources across spending areas when such movement reflects a proactive management decision taken to enable the Department to better manage emerging pressures in its existing baselines.

That is to facilitate better financial management, and Departments that have made use of the mechanism should be commended for their efforts to deal with emerging pressures. It has also been necessary, due largely to technical issues, to reclassify some amounts between different categories of expenditure. Details of all those changes are provided in the tables attached to written copies of this statement.

The net result of those transactions, taking account of the June monitoring outcome, was to reduce the level of overcommitment in current expenditure to £16·7 million; similarly, the net position for capital expenditure resulted in £8·4 million being made available to the Executive for allocation. Against that net position, Departments submitted current expenditure bids of £77·9 million and capital investment bids of £83 million. Some of those bids reflected pressures that were identified but not met as part of the June monitoring round. Full details of departmental bids are also attached to written copies of this statement.

Based on the tight in-year position, the greatly reduced level of money surrendered and the need to address the £127·8 million reduction imposed by the UK Government this year, the Executive agreed not to meet any current expenditure bids. The only exception was a small allocation to the Northern Ireland Audit Office to cover a pressure in respect of depreciation costs. That bid was met because the Audit Office’s requests for resources are normally honoured automatically.

Members should also note that the equal pay issue is imposing additional uncertainty to the in-year financial position. Payments are being progressed, and, although my Department holds financial cover for the estimated liability, there is a risk that the outcome may exceed the current estimate. The Executive have agreed that allocations to Departments for equal pay will be processed in December, when the final position will be known. The approach, which was agreed by the Executive, resulted in a residual current expenditure overcommitment of £16·8 million, which will have to be managed in the two remaining monitoring rounds this year.

With respect to capital funding, £8·4 million was available for allocation, which allowed the Executive to agree allocations to six Departments. I shall draw attention to the two largest allocations: £3·2 million was allocated to the Department of Culture, Arts and Leisure (DCAL) to cover a shortfall in receipts associated with the planned sale of the Public Record Office of Northern Ireland (PRONI) site at Balmoral; and £2·8 million was allocated to the Department for Employment and Learning (DEL) for essential health and safety works in the further education estate in order to ensure compliance with health and safety regulations. In addition to those allocations, some relatively small amounts of capital money went to the Department of Finance and Personnel (DFP), Department for Social Development (DSD), Office of the First Minister and deputy First Minister (OFMDFM) and Department of the Environment (DOE). Full details of those allocations are attached to written copies of this statement.

In total, capital investment resources were exhausted in this monitoring round, the outcome of which leaves the Executive with a zero capital overcommitment. In conclusion, the approach adopted by the Executive in the monitoring round has been, first and foremost, to address the residual pressure resulting from our share of the UK Government’s £6 billion public expenditure reduction in this financial year.

I believe that, at this stage of the financial year, an overcommitment of £16·8 million in current expenditure is manageable. However, given the remaining financial uncertainties and the public expenditure outlook, it is necessary not to increase that level of overcommitment further. The capital funding outcome left the Executive with no overcommitment, which we agreed was prudent, given the very low levels of money surrendered by Departments in the monitoring round. A less conservative approach would create a material risk that the Executive would have to impose further in-year reductions later in the financial year, when Departments would have little time to adjust. That is a risk that we were simply not prepared to take.

Nevertheless, the decision to adopt that approach was not taken lightly, since it left many Ministers disappointed. There are many areas in which we would have liked to have done more, and there are many ongoing financial pressures.

The upshot of that approach is that Ministers must now take urgent action to live within their existing budgets. They will have to identify where efficiencies and savings can be made and prioritise their spending plans to ensure that limited resources are put to the best possible use. That is true not only for this current year but for the upcoming Budget period. We are all aware of the tough times that lie ahead. It is imperative that the Executive work together to tackle the difficult financial decisions facing us. We must ensure that increasingly scarce resources are used in the best possible way to achieve the maximum benefit for the people of Northern Ireland. I commend the September monitoring round to the Assembly.

Jennifer McCann (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle. I thank the Minister for his statement and apologise to him for missing the beginning of it.

The Minister said that, as a result of negotiations with the Treasury, an additional £7·3 million in current expenditure and £0·9 million in capital expenditure is now available. Can he clarify what the total level of existing current and capital end-year flexibility is? Can he now assure the House that the Executive have full access to current and capital stocks?

Sammy Wilson (DUP, East Antrim)

At the moment, I cannot give the Chairperson the level of end-year flexibility that we have. I will put that figure in writing to her. We have been given the ability to draw down the money that was available to us in this Budget round. We will, of course, continue to negotiate with the Treasury to ensure that we have full access to that end-year flexibility. I am not too sure about the exact figure, although I may be able to get it before the end of this item of business, and if I can, I will. If not, I will write to the Chairperson.

Simon Hamilton (DUP, Strangford)

Given the way in which monitoring rounds appear to be developing in this financial year and the concern that that will inevitably cause over public spending, what further discussions has the Minister had with the Treasury about the developing budgetary position for Northern Ireland in the years ahead? What devices or mechanisms might the Treasury introduce to stimulate the private sector in Northern Ireland, as the now Prime Minister and the Secretary of State promised before the recent general election?

Sammy Wilson (DUP, East Antrim)

I meet Treasury Ministers constantly, as do my officials with their Treasury counterparts, to discuss the current position in Northern Ireland and the pressures that we will face over the next number of years. I know that there have been suggestions that, somehow or other, we are simply rolling over and accepting the current position, but nothing could be further from the truth. However, we have to balance that against the reality, which is that we face a difficult position and therefore need to plan for it.

However, in discussions with the Treasury, we have, first, highlighted the unique position of Northern Ireland, its dependence on public sector spending, our position in the economic cycle and the particular difficulty that we have with the banking system in Northern Ireland. Those, I believe, present special circumstances. Other Ministers in other regions have done the same. Secondly, over the summer, we had discussions with the Secretary of State and the Treasury on the package to help to rebalance the economy.

Thirdly, there have been negotiations with the Treasury, which, I hope, will come to a successful conclusion, on the Barnett consequentials that were imposed on Northern Ireland for the policing budget. The imposition of the Barnett consequentials led to a reduction of £23 million in that budget. We believe that the consequentials were not properly applied, and if that situation can be dealt with, not only will £23 million be available this year but the baseline for the policing budget will increase. Furthermore, there is the possibility of making a case to the Treasury for some access to the money that is available for policing for national security.

We are continually talking to the Treasury about a range of issues and are fighting for every penny that we can get for Northern Ireland. That is the right thing to do while, at the same time, planning for what we know is inevitable.

David McNarry (UUP, Strangford)

I welcome the turnaround on rates collection. Perhaps the Minister will expand on how he will invest, in money terms, that significant increase in received revenue. Will he confirm whether he is content that all Departments have fully declared their reduced requirements at this time?

Sammy Wilson (DUP, East Antrim)

The picture on rates collection is improving. The Member has, quite rightly, been critical of Land and Property Services in the past, as I have, and that situation needed to be turned around. For a small investment of £5 million in the June monitoring round, we have been able to put additional resources into identifying properties, dealing with revaluations and some other backlogs. That has given us £10 million. I also point out to the Member that, although it does not have any financial consequence for us this year, the level of debt this year so far has been brought down from £157 million, which was far too high, to £121 million. That, of course, will have a revenue consequence in future because we will not have to set as much money aside for bad debt.

His second question was about the reduced requirements. At present, all that we can do is to listen to what Ministers say and consider the reduced requirements that they bring to the table. However, as he will expect, my officials talk to officials in other Departments, and the indications are that no massive reduced requirements are lurking in Departments at present that will suddenly come to the table in either December or February. We try to avoid that because, at the end of the year, it is much more difficult to spend the money. However, we are not aware of any huge reduced requirements. That represents a tightening of the fiscal situation and it is one reason why I was very keen to bring down the overcommitment as quickly as possible.

Conall McDevitt (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast South)

I thank the Minister for his statement. In the previous monitoring round, the Department of Health, Social Services and Public Safety (DHSSPS) identified an underspend on swine flu that, if memory serves me right, totalled in excess of £15 million. The suggestion at that time was that that needed to be banked because of some financial rule. Has that money become available in this round? If so, is it factored into the figures?

Sammy Wilson (DUP, East Antrim)

The money that was not spent by the Department of Health, Social Services and Public Safety on swine flu was declared surplus to requirements at the end of the previous financial year in the February monitoring round. At that stage, all Departments — apart from, if my memory serves me right, the Department of Education — said that they could not spend the money. Therefore, it had to be returned to the Departments that made the contributions, and we indicated that we would bring it back in the June monitoring round. That has been done, and the money has been rightfully allocated to Departments. It was their money in the first place; they were top-sliced to make an allocation to deal with that incident. Once it was not spent, it had to go back to Departments.

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

I welcome the timely statement although I suspect that it somewhat represents the calm before the storm. Will the Minister confirm whether he intends to clear the entire £128 million pressure during this financial year?

I come back to the point about reduced requirements. There seems to be a pattern that our flexibility is entirely based around Departments surrendering major capital schemes, and there is an issue with the timeliness of that. For example, both of the projects that are cited in the Department of Culture, Arts and Leisure figures are ones for which, as I understand it, the money could have been released some time ago. The Minister may wish to address that timeliness issue with Departments.

Sammy Wilson (DUP, East Antrim)

The Member asked about the timeliness of reduced requirements from Departments. That is emphasised to Departments regularly.

Indeed, I hope that it was a salutary lesson to Departments. If money is held deliberately until the end of the year, we may have to conduct the same exercise that we conducted with DHSSPS last year and say that the Department will not get to hold on to the money but will get hit at the start of the next financial year because we will require the money to be repaid. All Departments will benefit from reduced requirements being identified early and returned to the pot so that the money can be used for the most pressing needs. That is a discipline that all Ministers need to abide by, because, collectively, it is in their interest to do so.

Although we can, it is my intention not to carry into next year the overcommitment from the budgetary cuts that were imposed in June. Given the tightness of next year’s position, we do not want to add to that overcommitment any further. Thus far, we have done well to manage the overcommitment down to its current level, and I am hopeful that, by the end of the financial year, we can manage it down to zero both on current and capital expenditure.

Paul Frew (DUP, North Antrim)

How does the Minister feel that the Executive are working together on the matter, and does he feel that Ministers realise that cuts will have to be made and that it is better to deal with most of the pressures now?

Sammy Wilson (DUP, East Antrim)

I have emphasised time and time again that, in planning for next year’s Budget, it is important that, first, we have a strategic picture of what we want to do. That includes consideration of issues such as where we want to direct expenditure, whether we want to raise revenue and, if so, how we wish to raise it.

In addition to those big strategic decisions, Ministers will look at their budgets and ask themselves whether they can find efficiencies. One does not find efficiencies at the last minute: some planning must be done. Ministers will have to consider whether they should give low priority to some areas of their budget and whether they should stop spending altogether on other areas because of the general direction in which we want to take the economy in Northern Ireland and because of the financial constraints that are on us.

A whole range of issues requires early sitting down and engagement among members of the Executive to get a broad picture of the direction in which we want to go, followed by discussion at departmental level so that we can allocate money to the important areas of departmental expenditure. As I have said before, we have not engaged properly as yet, but hopefully we will in the near future.

Cathal Boylan (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle. I welcome the Minister’s statement. As the Minister will be aware, the Committee for the Environment supported the Department of the Environment’s September monitoring round bid and welcomes the small amount of capital funding that he has allocated the Environment Agency for equipment and for health and safety works. However, the Committee was most concerned that the Department had identified a need for additional funds to cover the costs of staff who have yet to be relocated from the Planning Service but who, owing to planning receipt shortfalls, can no longer be afforded. How will those costs be covered?

Sammy Wilson (DUP, East Antrim)

There are two ways in which the costs can be covered. First, as I say to all Departments, they should deal with unmet bids by looking at their budgets to see how money might be reallocated and how changes might be made. As I pointed out in my statement, where there is proactive management of budgets, reclassifications of expenditure will be allowed, if the Minister makes a case for doing that.

The second way involves taking a bit of a chance, because we do not know what the picture will be. Departments will be capable of making bids in the December and February monitoring rounds. I understand that that leaves the bids until later in the year and that there is no guarantee that any money will be available, or, indeed, that bids that a particular Department makes will be given priority. The first and most important step should be to look at existing budgets and to decide whether, if something is considered to be a massive pressure, there are other areas from which money can be taken.

Paul Girvan (DUP, South Antrim)

I thank the Minister for his statement. In light of the commitment that Ministers and Departments must give to the Executive, what has been the level of buy-in from Departments on committing to the necessary cuts, based on the understanding that we must find £126 million or £127 million this year, never mind next year?

Sammy Wilson (DUP, East Antrim)

The good news is that we have found nearly all of the £127 million this year, and we are down to £16·8 million. I believe that we can and should manage it within the existing year. As far as next year is concerned, I have made it clear that I am disappointed at the level of engagement so far. I do not think that we can continue without stepping up to the mark. However, that must be done collectively because, at the end of the day, the Budget has to be agreed collectively by the Executive. There is no point in an individual Minister’s saying that we can progress with the Budget as much as we want but that he or she will vote against it. The issues are far too important.

People tell me that they want some certainty. They know that pain is coming, and they expect us to behave responsibly so that when we come to form the Budget, it will not be formed as some last-minute, thrown-together, cobbled compromise that wastes money. Rather, it should be constructed and presented in a way that shows some strategic thinking by the Executive.

Basil McCrea (UUP, Lagan Valley)

I want to follow up on the Minister’s answer to a colleague, in which he talked about his communications with the Treasury. He was keen to emphasise that we were not rolling over and that we would fight our case. He talked about the particular banking requirements here. Will the Minister outline his assessment of the dangers posed by the situation that is about to develop at the Anglo Irish Bank, the potential failure of the Irish Government’s bond markets and the possibility of their running to the International Monetary Fund (IMF)? The Minister said that, given the “remaining financial uncertainties” and the “public expenditure outlook”, he had been meaning to examine those matters. Has the Minister considered them in detail? If so, has he shared those concerns with the Treasury?

Sammy Wilson (DUP, East Antrim)

The Member knows that banking is not a devolved issue. Therefore, the role that the Executive have to play in banking is more one of liaising with the Treasury in England or the Finance Minister in the Republic, and I have done both.

With regard to the Irish banks, I have met and will continue to meet and communicate regularly with the Minister responsible for finance in the Republic. As a result of those representations, there is now an advisory panel, which includes two members from Northern Ireland. The panel specifically examines the kind of issues that may arise as a result of the activities of NAMA, the Irish banks and the Northern Ireland economy. We have two good representatives on the board, and they keep me informed. In addition, I continue to meet officials from NAMA, as I did over the summer, to discuss some of the concerns that the Member expressed about loans being taken on and the impact of the financial situation on the Irish banks.

The Member is right: the situation is extremely fragile. I also meet representatives from the individual banks. In the past two weeks, I met representatives of the First Trust Bank, which is a subsidiary of the Allied Irish Bank, to discuss banking issues. The Member knows that we do not have any powers to direct the banks. It is important, however, to highlight the problems, share the intelligence and try to find out what is being done to deal with the issues.

As far as the Treasury is concerned, that relates mostly to the activities of the Ulster Bank. The Department has access to Treasury officials and takes cases to the banking panel. The Department also receives regular updates on what is being done on bank lending, makes the case and tries to offer the local picture. Lack of lending by the banks is not unique to Northern Ireland. Indeed, I hear Members of the House of Commons complaining regularly about the activities of banks in England, Scotland and Wales and the lack of lending to businesses. At a Treasury level, there is some frustration, and the Department fills in the picture from a Northern Ireland perspective. Those are the types of things that it can do.

Alban Maginness (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast North)

The Minister raised the issue of banks. During a joint meeting of the Committee for Enterprise, Trade and Investment and the Committee for Finance and Personnel last week, it was made clear that ordinary customers are not being well served by the banks. Many have been refused proper credit facilities, and, when they are granted, they are restrictive and sometimes punitive. Did the Minister raise those issues with the banks, and, if so, what was their reaction?

On his discussions with the Treasury, the Minister, although he may not have wanted to do so, gave the public and the Assembly the impression that he has accepted the proposed savage cuts with resignation —

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

I encourage the Member to finish.

Alban Maginness (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast North)

The Minister has not given a robust defence of the special circumstances in Northern Ireland.

Sammy Wilson (DUP, East Antrim)

The Member will be aware that I am not known for a lack of robust responses. Indeed, on occasions, I get into trouble in that area. Of course the case has been made; at the last meeting that we had with Danny Alexander in the Treasury, the case was also made by Jane Hutt, the Welsh Finance Minister, and John Swinney, the Scottish Finance Minister. We all emphasised the timing and depth of the cuts and the impact that they are likely to have on regions of the United Kingdom that have special features, or features that are not common to the southern part of England.

The Member must bear in mind that an acceptance of the position that we are in does not mean that we are resigned to it. We must accept the reality; we cannot bury our heads in the sand and hope that it will not happen. The extent may vary, but we know that huge financial cuts will be imposed on Northern Ireland and on other parts of the United Kingdom, and we must prepare for those. That is not resignation, rolling over or surrendering. That is doing the job that everyone expects me to do as Finance Minister. If I were not doing that, the Member would have more justification for criticising the position that I have adopted.

As far as the banks are concerned, the Member has rightly identified some of the issues that people have brought to my attention. Those include the arbitrary nature of the changes in the terms and conditions that the banks impose, the cost of finance and the unwillingness to finance certain ventures. The banks’ response to me was that it now costs them more for raw materials and deposits, and, therefore, they are charging savers more. As far as the arbitrary changes are concerned, the banks tell me that they are obliged to give notice when they make changes in terms and conditions so that people have the opportunity to discuss those and to try to rejig them. However, stories have come back that that has not always been the case

They have also said that we are moving away from the days of businesses doing most of their financing through bank loans and, therefore, that businesses will have to look more at equity finance. That is the direction of travel that the monetary system is going in, and that will, of course, be a big adjustment for many small businesses here in Northern Ireland.

The case has been put often. For example, the day before I saw them, the banks had met the Churches. A whole host of people are raising issues such as those which the Member raised with the banks.

Maurice (DUP, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

I apologise to the Minister for not being here for the commencement of his statement. I was attending another meeting in the Building.

We need clarification on the cost of the PSNI hearing loss claims. I want to refer to a briefing paper that was presented to the Committee for Justice in August. Will the Minister outline the figures involved? A number of figures are being kicked about, and we need to ascertain exactly where all those figures come into place. We have been advised that there was a forecast for 2010-11 in which the cost of police hearing loss claims would be £29·8 million.

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

I encourage the Member to come to his question.

Maurice (DUP, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

That is part of my question. Will the Minister outline what progress has been made between the Executive and the Treasury regarding the Treasury acquiring saleable assets to assist the Executive to meet the first £12 million of the cost of hearing loss claims? Will he confirm that the remaining £17·8 million has been provided for from the reserve fund? Will he tell us how much has been allocated or paid out to date?

Sammy Wilson (DUP, East Antrim)

We are wandering well away from the September monitoring round. That is all I can say on the matter.

As the Department of Justice budget was ring-fenced for this year, there was not much engagement with that Department on the June monitoring round. Under the ring-fencing arrangement, the Department of Justice is allowed to keep and reallocate any reduced requirements it may have. All it has to do is simply notify us of that. As a result, I have had no detailed discussions about the spending that there has been on hearing loss claims this year. Therefore, I cannot confirm the figures that the Member raised. However, as he has raised the issue, I will speak to the Justice Minister about that and write to the Member.

John McCallister (UUP, South Down)

In his statement, the Minister spoke about banking. How likely does he think it is that the Irish Government will default as regards the Anglo Irish Bank and have to go to the IMF? If that happens, what would be the knock-on effect for us?

Sammy Wilson (DUP, East Antrim)

I am not going to speculate on what may happen to the finances of a foreign jurisdiction. However, from the conversations that I have had with the Finance Minister in the Republic, I know that every attempt had been made to safeguard against the kind of event that the Member described. Obviously, given the fact that a lot of banking in Northern Ireland rests on the activities of banks based not in the UK but in the Irish Republic — a point that we made to the Treasury in London — any disturbance in its banking system is bound to have a disproportionate impact on Northern Ireland.

Patsy McGlone (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Mid Ulster)

The Minister mentioned the prioritisation of spending plans to ensure that limited resources are put to the best possible use and the need for strategic thinking. As the Minister knows, times are very tight, especially in constituencies where a high number of people are or were employed in the construction industry.

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

I ask the Member to come to his question.

Patsy McGlone (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Mid Ulster)

Sure. What measures are being taken across Departments to ensure that expenditure for capital schemes is made available quickly and efficiently to ensure that people are at least maintained in jobs with companies in the construction sector? I profess, at this stage, both a constituency sectional interest and a regional interest.

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

I ask the Member to bring his remarks to a close.

Patsy McGlone (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Mid Ulster)

Will the Minister give me some detail about the police training college at Cookstown?

Sammy Wilson (DUP, East Antrim)

The Member has certainly got a press statement for the local paper. [Laughter.] I suppose that that is the main point of his question. You have indulged him, Mr Speaker.

The Executive will be responsible for £1·7 billion of capital spend this year. Not all of that, of course, will go to the construction industry. However, it is a very high level of capital spend and one that is unlikely to be replicated in future years. As for getting schemes on the ground quickly, we have tried to improve the whole procurement process by ensuring that it is streamlined and that contracts get out. My DOE colleague, Mr Poots, has, through the planning reform proposals, also sought to improve the planning process to ensure that there are no hold-ups.

Through improving the whole procurement process, we seek to ensure that schemes are not delayed by judicial reviews brought by people who did not win tenders. I have said the following before, and, indeed, I say it every time I meet employers and other people who are involved in the construction industry, but I need to emphasise it. It is one thing for us to change our processes here, and we should. We should look at our processes continually to ensure that they are not slow, cumbersome or causing delay. However, even when we do that, some people who did not get contracts enter into lengthy judicial reviews simply because they did not like the result of the procurement process. That, in turn, holds up projects. Both sides — the construction industry and us — have a responsibility to ensure that that does not happen.

The police training college is still part of the Department of Justice’s capital proposals. However, there will be other demands on the capital budget, such as prisons. It is up to the Minister of Justice to decide which of those will be his priority in constrained capital circumstances.

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

That ends questions on the Minister of Finance and Personnel’s statement. I am sorry: Anno Lo is next. I apologise to the House.

Anna Lo (Alliance, Belfast South)

In many ways, Mr McGlone asked my question. I am disappointed that the Department for Social Development’s bid for the social housing development programme did not get any money, as that would certainly have helped the construction industry. What plans does the Minister have to help that industry through providing public spending for schools maintenance, the Egan contracts and so on?

Sammy Wilson (DUP, East Antrim)

We can allocate money only if it is available for allocation. As I pointed out in my statement, the amount of reduced requirements in the capital budget, which was approximately £18 million, meant that there was not a lot of money for reallocation. I must point out, however, that the social housing budget has been very well provided for by this Executive. Indeed, last year, we had a record social housing build of 1,800 units. I have no doubt that the former Minister for Social Development will take some credit for that. The fact that we have had a record build in recent years is an indication of the priority that has been given to the social housing programme.

There are other massive demands, but the Department for Social Development has not done too badly in the current monitoring rounds. In June, £10 million was allocated for urban regeneration projects, which will, of course, help the construction industry and help to kick-start economic development in lots of towns around Northern Ireland. Therefore, I think that the Minister for Social Development probably cannot complain. In fact, other Ministers have had more cause for complaint and have complained much more vociferously because they have not had any bids met in the two monitoring rounds so far.

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

That finally ends questions on the Minister of Finance and Personnel’s statement. Once again, I apologise to the Member.

Personal Statement

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

The Minister of Health, Social Services and Public Safety has sought leave to make a personal statement. Before calling the Minister, I remind the House that a personal statement should be heard in silence. It is not a debate, and questions cannot be asked about it. I also advise the House, as I did this morning, that I will not be taking any points of order on any matter following the statement. I hope that is clear to all Members.

Michael McGimpsey (UUP, Belfast South)

Thank you for giving me the opportunity to make a personal statement to the House. I very much wanted to make the statement yesterday, but I was awaiting legal advice around some of the complex issues involved in this tragic case. On 21 September, I answered a question for urgent oral answer in relation to the McDermott brothers. In response to a supplementary question from Mrs Foster, I said:

“As I understand it, the doctor to whom Mrs Foster refers was not an employee of the trust.” — [Official Report, Vol 55, No 4, p182, col 2].

I subsequently learned that the doctor was employed by the trust. That error was a genuine mistake for which I take full responsibility, and I wish to apologise to you, Mr Speaker, and to the House.

Private Members’ Business

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

The Business Committee has agreed to allow up to one hour and 30 minutes for the debate. The proposer will have 10 minutes to propose the motion and 10 minutes to make a winding-up speech. One amendment has been selected and published on the Marshalled List. The proposer of the amendment will have 10 minutes to propose and five minutes to make a winding-up speech. All other Members who wish to speak will have five minutes.

Margaret Ritchie (Social Democratic and Labour Party, South Down)

I beg to move

That this Assembly acknowledges that there will be no good relations on this island without equality, and no equality without good relations; recognises that people who are socially disadvantaged suffer most from sectarian division; affirms the need for strong political leadership and independent voices to challenge government to progress lasting change; believes that government must tackle the origins and manifestations of sectarianism and racism through a robust Executive strategy; notes the publication of the programme for cohesion, sharing and integration; and believes that the consultation document fails to provide an adequate framework to enable progress towards a shared and reconciled society.

I thank my SDLP colleagues for tabling this motion, and, in particular, I thank Conall McDevitt, who leads our policy work stream in the area of building a shared future.

After three years of waiting for the Office of the First Minister and deputy First Minister to produce anything at all, I saw the first draft of the proposed cohesion, sharing and integration strategy, and I must say that I was deeply disappointed. The first draft, which was circulated some months ago, remains one of the worst documents that I have ever read. It did not mention a shared future or how we could progress towards one. It said little or nothing about the way in which we educate our children, the way in which we live in segregated communities and how evidence shows that, if you live in a single identity community, you are much more likely to be poor, unemployed, suffer ill health and early death. It did not even mention the only state agency that openly pursues a shared future agenda: the Community Relations Council. Instead, the OFMDFM paper focused primarily on the need to correct bad behaviour, as if a shared future might somehow be achieved automatically if people desisted from certain behaviours. The paper’s language and drafting were appalling. I am sure that it was not the handiwork of skilled civil servants; it resembled something from a George Orwell novel. It was as though the text had been produced by robots, devoid of empathy and intuition.

Although the next draft, which was pushed quickly through the Executive and is out for consultation, was slightly better, the central problem persists: it is a strategy for sharing that says nothing meaningful about sharing. The OFMDFM cohesion, sharing and integration strategy envisions a future in which there are still two separate communities. The height of its ambition is to have two communities that are still separate and unreconciled but are, generally, at peace and not attacking or abusing each other. That is what it means by “good relations”. To my party, that represents poverty of ambition.

Although improved community relations are a prerequisite for building a shared society, they cannot be the end point. The Assembly must simply aim higher. It must set itself the goal of creating one reconciled, shared society that is completely comfortable with difference. Essentially, a normal society is one in which no one is in the least bit bothered which church their next-door neighbours attend or which party they vote for. Why can the Assembly not show that a normal society is its ambition? Why does the OFMDFM strategy fall short of that higher standard? Why is the CSI strategy so mealy-mouthed on reconciliation and sharing?

When one thinks about it, the answer is obvious, albeit disappointing. The truth is that the authors of the draft shared future strategy — the DUP and Sinn Féin — do not actually believe in sharing. They honestly do not want a shared future. They prefer the traditional division that affords them power in their single-identity communities: power and control before all else and carve-up before sharing. Therefore, the task that they set themselves was beyond what they are capable of achieving. That is why it took three years to produce the draft CSI document. That is why the current document is simply inadequate and unfit for purpose. Yet, it is now being offered cynically to the public for comment.

Even as it stands, it is clear that OFMDFM Ministers have little confidence in what they have produced. They organised public consultation meetings, but they left it to their officials to meet the public. The two First Ministers and even the two junior Ministers were too busy to stand in front of people to answer questions and explain themselves. Incidentally, I have been told that there is a suggestion that the strategy has the support of all parties in the Executive. That is not true. I will examine the records of those meetings closely.

So far, polite society has been, well, quite polite about the new cohesion, sharing and integration strategy. People who have been engaged in the hard work of cross-community reconciliation and peace building have welcomed the fact that the paper has finally been produced. However, behind the scenes, I know that, in many cases, their blood is boiling. Their hopes and expectations have been dashed by what they know to be a cynical exercise by two cynical parties. They know that they are not being listened to. In the document, they see spurious detail about possible management structures and who would be in control of what. Alongside that, they see the document’s utter absence of concrete proposals for building a better society.

Last year, when I held 14 public meetings to discuss how the Department for Social Development could advance the shared future agenda — 14 public meetings, which, incidentally, I fronted — I came across many people who longed for the normality of a genuinely shared society in this part of the world. There is no doubt in my mind that the public whom we serve believe overwhelmingly in a shared society, but they will not get that from this OFMDFM strategy. The absence of real intent to deliver on the part of the DUP and Sinn Féin serves only to conceal the real absence in all of this: the absence of leadership.

Although it is relatively easy for our joint First Ministers to grit their teeth and stand together to condemn negative events, such as dissident violence or racist attacks, where are the examples of positive leadership? Where is the reaching out across the divide? [Laughter.] Well may some of you laugh. When does it ever get past, “You get that for your side, and we will get that for our side”?

Last week, we saw the worst of that mentality when no one at OFMDFM picked up the invitation to participate in the papal visit to the United Kingdom. I said little at the time, because the Pope’s visit was continuing, but I thought that it was disgraceful. Suffice it to say that it is a measure of the DUP and Sinn Féin’s closed minds that we have one Minister who cannot risk being in the same room as the Pope, even at the invitation of the Queen, and another who is afraid of being in the same room as the Queen. Nor did they pass on the invitation so that our devolved Administration could be represented, for, in the carve-up world of OFMDFM, they alone are the Government.

We will not heal the deep divisions in this community if we do not get leadership from those who have the most power. Leadership starts by recognising that there is no credible alternative to a shared future. The maintenance of two better regulated but still deeply divided communities cannot be the answer. OFMDFM will have the opportunity to rewrite the cohesion, sharing and integration strategy after this phase of consultation. They know that it needs to be completely rewritten and to be supported by resources and a timetable for action. Despite the flawed process, the SDLP will submit a detailed and purposeful paper, which will help get the initiative back on track. This is an opportunity for all of us to move on and to lead and reach for the next horizon. I commend the motion to the House and pledge the best efforts of my party in this vital work.

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

As this is the first occasion on which the Assembly will hear from Mr Lyttle, I remind the House that it is the convention that a maiden speech is made without interruption.

Chris Lyttle (Alliance, Belfast East)

I beg to move the following amendment: At end insert

“; and calls on the Executive to ensure that a revised programme includes a clearly articulated vision of a cohesive, shared and integrated society and an action plan covering policies, resource allocations, targets, timetables and evaluation criteria.”

May I take this opportunity to thank you, Mr Speaker, and your colleagues for the warm welcome to the Assembly that I have been given and to put on record the honour and privilege that it is to be appointed to represent the people of East Belfast in the House? I am immensely proud of the constituency that I have lived in all my life. East Belfast is not only the seat of our Assembly but is widely recognised for its rich industrial, cultural and sporting heritage. Names such as Harland and Wolff, C S Lewis, Van Morrison and George Best are world renowned, and, although some traditional industry in the area has declined, I believe that the enterprise, creativity and imagination of our people remain our most important resource in tackling social disadvantage and promoting economic development in this region.

I am aware that I follow in the line of distinguished parliamentarians who have represented the constituency with exceptional ability and, at times, no small measure of the feistiness and wit that are required to survive in this arena. I am sure that the House will agree that those qualities apply to no one more than my predecessor, Naomi Long, and will join me in paying tribute to the tremendous record of leadership that she had in the House. Naomi has been an outstanding Member of the Assembly and will continue to be a formidable representative for this region in her role as Member of Parliament for East Belfast. As deputy leader of the Alliance Party and as a former Deputy Chairperson of the Committee for the Office of the First Minister and deputy First Minister, Naomi has been the strongest advocate of the need for a serious and overarching good relations policy to underpin the work of every Department and to drive forward the work of the Executive. It is leaders such as Naomi and people in organisations such as the Alliance Party, who prioritised tackling the deep division in our community and believe that there is more to unite us than divide us, who inspired me to take my own stand for a shared and better future on behalf of my community. It is pertinent, therefore, that my maiden contribution in the House is to move the amendment to the motion on equality and good relations.

The Alliance Party welcomes the historic opportunity represented by the publication of the draft programme for cohesion, sharing and integration, and it welcomes the debate on that important matter today. Although my party will support the motion as tabled, I seek the support of the House for our sensible amendment.

I want to make it clear from the outset that the challenge of delivering equality and good relations in Northern Ireland must be much more important than any one party political agenda. That being the case, the Alliance Party recognises the progress that has been made by local politicians in taking ownership of the draft strategy and the public consultation process associated with it. However, we must also recognise the fact that the current proposal is inadequate in some aspects and could be significantly improved. Our amendment sets out the nature of those inadequacies in broad terms and encourages OFMDFM and the wider Executive to address them in detail when the new programme is finalised.

The Alliance Party believes that the healing of deep divisions in this society is the greatest challenge for the Assembly. It has a vision of a cohesive, shared and integrated society, where people are safe and prosperous, have ample opportunities and are treated fairly and respectfully. We want to deliver a normal civic society underpinned by our shared values of equality, respect for diversity and interdependence. The critical measure for the programme must be what it will do for community relations in Northern Ireland.

We have spent approximately £1.5 billion on peace building in Northern Ireland, but that model is coming to an end. We need to take responsibility for the ongoing human and economic cost of getting this issue wrong. At a time of immense financial pressure, the fundamental link between a shared society and economic development should be a major driver of change. With approximately 70,000 spare school places and a crumbling schools estate, it is vital that robust education reform proposals are included in the policy. The establishment of a single integrated system that is shared by all children must be a priority. For good reasons, people in contested places are cautious about the education of their children. However, the delivery mechanisms that reflect historic interests cannot be the driver for our children’s education in twenty-first-century Northern Ireland.

We must also not make the mistake of regarding community relations work solely as individually funded projects but see it rather as an ethos that runs throughout our system of government. However, I take this opportunity to pay tribute to the excellent strategic work of the Community Relations Council and to the many men, women and children who make their own significant contribution to improving community relations across our community, often in the most difficult conditions.

As I mentioned previously, past initiatives of that type occurred under direct rule, including, most recently, the shared future strategy in 2005. Although there was little wrong with that strategy, I am sure that the House will agree that it is much more desirable that local political institutions take ownership of the development and delivery of future strategies. The Alliance Party was, therefore, pleased to play a part in the agreement of a draft policy this year. However, it is worth recognising the fact that the current draft is an ongoing work and that significant concerns have been raised about its current content. The consultation exercise is, therefore, critical, and I was encouraged by the First Minister’s remarks yesterday during Question Time, when he reflected on OFMDFM’s record of responding positively to consultation recommendations. It is incumbent on OFMDFM and the Executive to take on board what is received and to amend the programme accordingly — indeed, to amend it radically.

It is good to have a Government document that tackles issues such as shared space, shared education, shared housing, visible manifestations of racism, sectarianism, bonfires, flags, the cost of duplicated services and zero tolerance of hate crimes, and many of the key themes for actions are also in there. In that respect, the glass is half full. However, the vision of the document is weak and less developed. It is entitled cohesion, sharing and integration (CSI), but at no stage are any of those concepts well defined. Specifically, there is no affirmation of a shared society, and the underlying assumption of managing a divided society and separate communities remains. We are, therefore, in danger of having a shared-out future rather than the shared future that this region needs and deserves.

Cohesion, in particular, is the new standard in the field of community relations, and some very relevant work on it has been carried out in Great Britain. However, there is very little reference in the document to developing good practice beyond our shores. The Alliance Party is also wary of a hierarchy between equality and good relations. The document must recognise that there can be no sustainable equality in the region without a sense of solidarity, interdependence and sharing. Equality arguments should not be used to undermine good relations, and vice versa. We also regret that there is not sufficient recognition of the economic and financial costs of continued divisions and of the opportunities that would come from a shared society. That is critical to understanding the full structural problems faced in the economy and to appreciating what will provide a real motivating force for devising a strong CSI strategy.

We need a clear vision of cohesion, sharing and integration and a detailed action plan against which to resource, target, timetable, monitor, evaluate and deliver that programme. The CSI programme must not be considered as just another document but a historic opportunity to make reconciliation, equality and good relations a reality for this and future generations of our community. Tremendous progress has occurred in the peace process over the past 15 years, including during this Assembly mandate. In order to realise our full potential, however, the political process must articulate a clear vision of a shared society and devise a robust action plan to address the ongoing human and financial cost of prejudice and segregation to our community.

Jimmy Spratt (DUP, Belfast South)

Equality and good relations are a key component of any modern society; therefore I am pleased to speak in the debate.

For far too long, sectarianism and division have been a hallmark of life in Northern Ireland, and I welcome the First Minister and the deputy First Minister’s considerable efforts to reduce and eradicate that cancer from our society. There has been much criticism of the cohesion, sharing and integration document: that it took too long to produce and that it lacks detail on timescales, actions and targets. However, this is a massive and important task, and it is critical to get it right. As Members are aware, the consultation process provided an opportunity to identify and address any issues that have not been included. The CSI document should be seen as the beginning of a very substantial process.

As I said before, Northern Ireland has been riven with sectarian divisions for far too long; it is a way of life for some people in the Province, and it will take a long time to change attitudes. That can be achieved only through a number of initiatives. However, I do not want to give the impression that work has not already been done to tackle those issues. Many organisations and, indeed, individuals have worked tirelessly over the years to create a better future for everyone, and that must be commended. However, much of that work has been done at the coalface. The CSI strategy is a political agreement at a high strategic level, and it must be said that this is the first time that that has been achieved in the Assembly. That is clearly a major development, and it should be recognised as such.

As the deputy First Minister said, the clear intention is to set targets and actions to take forward the strategy and make a real difference. Those targets will be monitored and ensured by the ministerial panel, and they should be fully integrated with the Programme for Government and the public service agreements (PSAs). There is no doubt that the First Minister and deputy First Minister intend to follow through on their pledge to tackle the deep divisions in our society. The fact that there has been a consultation process and that there will be input from all Departments ensures that all interested parties have an opportunity to contribute to that vital and strategic policy document.

It is also important to note that the document does not simply focus on tackling sectarianism and racism but affirms that all forms of intolerance, including hate crimes, antisocial behaviour, harassment, discrimination, recreational rioting and interface issues are to be recognised as unacceptable in our society. That also includes attacks on people on any basis, such as age, disability, race, sexual orientation or gender. In respect of good relations, the First Minister stated:

“There can be no room for sectarianism, racism or any form of hate crime. Attacks or violence that are motivated by any of those are unacceptable and must be condemned. … It is not only words of condemnation that are required but an identification of the causes of bad relations and actions to tackle the problem.” — [Official Report, Vol 46, No 1, p23, col 2].

The concept of good relations has been in the mix for some time. OFMDFM has already provided major funding and worked with local councils and the Community Relations Council to achieve good relations. As I said, much has already been done to change attitudes. However, with the backing of the First and deputy First Ministers, we will have in place a high-level strategic plan that will have a long-term impact. If we are to develop the economy and attract investment from overseas, we must not allow the scenes of recreational rioting and interface tensions that made the headlines in July this year. All crimes and violence that are motivated by hate and intolerance must be challenged.

I do not agree, however, with the motion’s last statement:

“the consultation document fails to provide an adequate framework to enable progress towards a shared and reconciled society.”

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

The Member should bring his remarks to a close.

Jimmy Spratt (DUP, Belfast South)

Therefore, we cannot support the motion that is before the House today.

Martina Anderson (Sinn Féin, Foyle)

Go raibh míle maith agat. The motion and the amendment betray a lack of understanding of the equality provisions in section 75(1) of the 1998 Act. For that reason, we will reject the motion and the amendment.

The motion clearly suggests that equality and good relations are coequal sides of one coin; that they are both as important as each other. That is simply not the case, because good relations can be built only upon equality. Equality cannot and should not be built upon good relations. Shame on Margaret Ritchie, the leader of the SDLP, for driving such an agenda.

Let us take housing as an example. If we were to work on the basis of objective need, it might be shown, for instance, that more Catholics are on the waiting list and need allocated housing or that more Protestants are on the waiting list and need allocated housing. However, some people could object to having Catholics or Protestants living nearby because it would have a detrimental impact on good relations. The SDLP’s motion promotes the idea of equal status for equality and good relations. Is the SDLP saying that, were that to be the case, housing for Catholics or for Protestants could be blocked on that basis? Where would that have left the Gildernews?

Conall McDevitt (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast South)

If we are going to have a debate, it is important that we understand the difference between equality and equity. Ms Anderson seems to have forgotten the basic lesson of the schoolmistress who invites her children to take off a shoe and throw it into the middle of the room and then invites the children to blindfold themselves and pick up a shoe, and they do. They sit down, and the schoolmistress asks the children whether they are happy. They say, “No; not particularly. We are not happy.” She asks, “Oh, why are you not happy?” and they say, “Because we have all ended up with each other’s shoes”. The schoolmistress says, “But I did things equally. I treated you all equally. You all had the opportunity to pick up a shoe, and you now have a shoe”.

The problem is, as with Ms Anderson’s analysis — [Interruption.]

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

Order.

Conall McDevitt (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast South)

As with Ms Anderson’s analysis, that does not consider the fundamental issue, which is that you cannot decide equality until you understand need, and until you understand need, you do not get equality, and that is why good relations are so important.

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

Order. It is good practice that interventions should be short and to the point. [Laughter.] That is good practice not only in this House but elsewhere. The Member has a minute added to her time.

Martina Anderson (Sinn Féin, Foyle)

I should have an extra two or three minutes. I appreciate that Conall McDevitt is a new MLA, and perhaps he does not understand section 75(1) and section 75(2) of the 1998 Act. The thinking and intention behind section 75(1) was that equality should always, absolutely always, take priority. Good relations — section 75(2) — will flow from that.

Equality is necessary; good relations are desirable. Equality is the primary duty, and I find it disappointing, but absolutely not surprising, that the SDLP do not seem to recognise that. What else would we expect from a party that opposed the MacBride principles? Perhaps the proposers of the motion, one of whom is the leader of the SDLP, are once again seeking to remove what their previous leader once referred to as the ugly scaffolding of the Good Friday Agreement — that same ugly scaffolding that exists to safeguard the rights and entitlements of nationalists.

Those protections were hard won. They were hard won — [Interruption.]

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

Order.

Martina Anderson (Sinn Féin, Foyle)

They were hard won.

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

Order. Allow the Member to continue.

Martina Anderson (Sinn Féin, Foyle)

They were hard won, and nationalists and republicans can take heart that Sinn Féin, and Sinn Féin representatives, have absolutely no intention of surrendering them.

I welcome the fact that the cohesion, sharing and integration strategy document has been published for consultation, a consultation that provides us all with an opportunity to strengthen the strategy. The cohesion, sharing and integration strategy is a cross-cutting policy, and, as such, it needs to be driven at the highest level of leadership. As an indication of intent, the cohesion, sharing and integration document proposes a panel led by our First Minister and deputy First Minister that will work with a reinvigorated racial equality forum and other stakeholder groups, communities, and communities of interest.

The consultation document should be critically appraised. That is to be welcomed. The junior Minister in the Chamber yesterday talked about how he attended meetings, and there definitely were such critical appraisals. I welcome the fact that for the first time the dialogue to facilitate the development of cohesion, sharing and integration in this society is, if the SDLP will read it at paragraph 1.6 of the consultation document, framed in the context of:

“equality and the enforcement of rights.”

However, Sinn Féin has been clear from the day that the draft cohesion, sharing and integration strategy document was published that it was not the final article, and we heard the First Minister make such a reference yesterday.

We all have an opportunity to shape the final strategy —

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

The Member should draw her remarks to a close.

Martina Anderson (Sinn Féin, Foyle)

For all the reasons that I outlined, we will not be supporting the motion or the amendment.

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

The Member’s time is up.

Martina Anderson (Sinn Féin, Foyle)

Go raibh míle maith agat.

Danny Kinahan (UUP, South Antrim)

I congratulate Chris Lyttle on his maiden speech. I thank the Members for tabling this motion. I have got myself in a muddle; bear with me. The Ulster Unionist Party will work constructively — bear with me just a second; I had shuffled my documents. Thank you for bearing with me.

I thank the Members who tabled the motion for doing so. Northern Ireland’s recent history has been turbulent and violent. That has left us with a legacy of segregation, mistrust and, in some cases, open hostility. The Belfast Agreement brought us peace and created political institutions that have largely served to regulate our differences.

However, we have not taken the necessary steps to move towards a society that is genuinely pluralist, genuinely integrationist and genuinely built on respect for our different traditions. That is evidenced by the fact that we have more peace lines today than we did in 1998. More people live in segregated communities, and there is growing violence from dissident republicans. That is despite us having probably the most stringent equality regime in Europe.

The Ulster Unionist Party believes in a genuinely pluralist Northern Ireland. We believe in a genuinely tolerant United Kingdom, and we believe in building genuine respect and integration between all groups in our society. So, it is clear that we have a job of work to do. However, we must be aware of what is at stake.

We cannot allow our children and young people to repeat a history of segregation and intolerance. The motion is also right to point out that in areas of social deprivation, segregation is at its most acute. If we fail to get this right, we will be dooming not only those communities but potentially our entire community. Would any international investors have been inspired to invest by the scenes in the Ardoyne in July? It is that reality that makes the document produced by Sinn Féin and the DUP so disappointing.

The delay in the production of the cohesion, sharing and integration strategy appears to be due to differences between building good relations and equality. It has long been a position of Sinn Féin to diminish emphasis on good relations in favour of an ideological, divisive and exclusive focus on the equality agenda. The cohesion, sharing and integration document does not provide any solutions to that dilemma. Instead, it promotes the separate but equal agenda. That creates a danger of furthering a factory of grievances approach. The culmination of that approach in the document is the potential abolition of the Community Relations Council (CRC), if two of the four options available are chosen. Whatever the CRC’s flaws, it has provided an independent voice on an issue that some politicians have often sought to avoid.

The draft cohesion, sharing and integration strategy lacks goals beyond the general; it has no specific action plans and offers very little on young people, housing and education. Action in those areas is crucial if we are to avoid repeating ourselves. The document is more about sharing out than a shared future, and I am concerned that it will lead to a Balkanisation agenda being pursued without criticism and scrutiny. It also does not do enough to integrate other minorities in Northern Ireland.

Reflecting on that, some of the language in the SDLP’s motion is unhelpful. The SDLP appears to be riding two horses at once. Of course we all want a more equal society, but we do not want a “one for you and one for me” mentality to pervade in the cohesion, sharing and integration strategy. That is especially true as we enter a period of much-reduced funding. The logical conclusion of the opening sentence of the SDLP’s motion is paralysis and a stand-off.

The Ulster Unionist Party will work constructively with and for any legitimate group in Northern Ireland, and we will pursue a shared future that is not based on gimmicks —

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

Will the Member bring his remarks to a close?

Danny Kinahan (UUP, South Antrim)

We will do that because we want a better Northern Ireland and because we are —

Conall McDevitt (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast South)

Will the Member give way?

Danny Kinahan (UUP, South Antrim)

No. We will do that because we are unapologetic unionists who want a strong and positive union, and we will do that because it is right.

George Robinson (DUP, East Londonderry)

Equality and good relations must be one of the most difficult topics in Northern Ireland, but nobody should have any doubt that my party and I are committed to equality and good relations for all in Northern Ireland. On 3 September 2010, the First Minister said:

“We are at the beginning of a very important process and we want to hear the views of people throughout our society on how we can build a better future for everyone.”

That is a clear indication of my party’s thinking on the way forward. It is also a clear statement of the support that this side of the House has for the principle of equality for everyone. Everyone will be treated equally in the Northern Ireland that is being built.

It is sadly true that those who suffer most from inequality are those who are at the greatest disadvantage for whatever reason — disability, unemployment or race. The Assembly must ensure that inequality is not common in society. I am also convinced that strong political leadership has been shown. The fact that the Assembly has not collapsed over the past three and a half years proves that strong leadership has been given, especially by the First Minister and his predecessor, Lord Bannside. That is reflected in the programme for cohesion, sharing and integration.

As elected representatives, we must all lead by example, particularly when making statements to the press and in public places, so that we do not inflame situations, such as occurred recently in Coleraine. If we are to build a society equal for all, we must choose our words very carefully. It is most regrettable that Members who signed the motion did not reflect on the early stage that the consultation process is at. The motion does little to promote cohesion, sharing or integration; it does the opposite.

Northern Ireland needs a peaceful future, and the programme for cohesion, sharing and integration is an important milestone in achieving that. If the party that supports the motion wants that state of affairs, it should not put further divisive motions before the Assembly but work positively to achieve the equality that it says it wants.

Daithí McKay (Sinn Féin, North Antrim)

I oppose the motion and the amendment, as my party colleague outlined.

Fundamentally, equality cannot and should not be built on good relations. The CSI document highlights that equality is the foundation of good relations and that good relations can only be built on equality.

Section 75 of the Northern Ireland Act 1998 places a duty on public authorities to treat people equally, regardless of race, age, marital status, religious belief, political opinion, or sexual orientation. By making the maintenance of good relations a duty equal to equality, many progressive policies to tackle inequality would be vetoed. That would be bad for good relations, or so some politicians in our community would argue.

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

I am grateful to the Member for giving way and I promise not to mention shoes. [Laughter.]

I ask the Member to consider that the problem that Sinn Féin articulates with regard to the relationship between equality and good relations is actually a misunderstanding of the concept of good relations, which has been used and abused by certain politicians. If we talk about good relations in a context of sharing, it implies respect for diversity, which does not threaten equality; whereas, if someone objects to something and employs a “good relations” argument against it, it represents a warping of the notion of a shared society and the idea of good relations.

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

The Member may have an extra minute to speak.

Daithí McKay (Sinn Féin, North Antrim)

I thank the Member for his intervention, but different parties have different interpretations of “good relations”.

For example, members of the lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender (LGBT) community could apply to their local council for funding for a gay pride parade or a public event, and local councillors could employ the argument that funding or holding such an event in their community or in a particular area would be bad for good relations in that area. Councillors would be wrong to employ that argument, but some would. That could — would — happen, given the views of some political parties.

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

That is exactly the point that I was trying to make; it is a clear example of a misunderstanding of the concept of good relations in a shared society; it is an abuse of the concept. That should not happen.

Daithí McKay (Sinn Féin, North Antrim)

Equality should be safeguarded at all times; it has to be the cornerstone of society and must be ahead of good relations. That is why in this case —

Basil McCrea (UUP, Lagan Valley)

Will the Member give way again?

Daithí McKay (Sinn Féin, North Antrim)

No. Two interventions are enough, Basil.

We will not support that; we will not support the undermining of equality safeguards in society, and we will not support the dilution of the equality legislation secured in the Good Friday Agreement. Equality is the bottom line as far as Sinn Féin is concerned. Sectarianism and intolerance are still rife in this society, and we must ensure that an effective strategy is in place, and that funding is used effectively to tackle those problems.

The concept of good relations taking priority over equality has led to the consolidation and ingraining of inequality in some cases and has been used by those opposed to the equality agenda to undermine hard-fought equality measures. Some of the aims and objectives outlined are to be welcomed, as the Member for East Belfast Chris Lyttle said earlier. Those include zero tolerance on crimes motivated by prejudice and all forms of hate crime; working to eliminate attacks on cultural, sports and other symbolic property and monuments, including GAA halls and Orange Halls in our community; maximising the impact of funding on the ground; and encouraging shared neighbourhoods and eliminating segregated services. That is worth working towards.

The CSI document could be better. One of the parties involved in the Office of the First Minister and deputy First Minister is progressive and the other is not. Sinn Féin not only wants to see the LGBT sector —

Alban Maginness (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast North)

Who is progressive and who is not?

Daithí McKay (Sinn Féin, North Antrim)

It does not take a genius, Alban.

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

Order.

Daithí McKay (Sinn Féin, North Antrim)

Sinn Féin not only wants to see the LGBT sector fully involved in this process, but wants to see their concerns dealt with effectively.

Conall McDevitt (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast South)

Why do you not include them in —

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

Order.

Daithí McKay (Sinn Féin, North Antrim)

The CSI strategy will not resolve sectarianism and the prejudicial attitudes that exist in this society. One hears a lot of comments from the SDLP about the document, and it is critical of what has been put together so far. However, that is only the first step in the process. It is worth remembering that the SDLP had ample opportunity to put together such a document when it was in the same office with the Ulster Unionist Party. It did not achieve anything. We got nothing from the SDLP. It is all very well for the party to come here and try to criticise us for what has been brought forward, but it has not been able to do any of that work itself. Shame on the SDLP for bringing the motion forward, and shame on the SDLP for trying to undermine the equality legislation that was secured after decades of hard work. It does not understand the impact of what it is putting forward —

Alban Maginness (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast North)

After decades of violence —

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

Order, order.

Daithí McKay (Sinn Féin, North Antrim)

The SDLP should go back to the —

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

Order. Allow the Member to finish.

Daithí McKay (Sinn Féin, North Antrim)

They should try to understand the impact of what they are proposing. Go raibh maith agat.

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

The Business Committee has arranged to meet immediately during the lunchtime suspension today. I propose, therefore, by leave of the Assembly, to suspend the sitting until 2.00 pm. The first Member to speak after lunchtime will be Mr Allan Bresland.

The sitting was suspended at 12.28 pm.

On resuming (Mr Deputy Speaker [Mr Dallat] in the Chair) —

Allan Bresland (DUP, West Tyrone)

I want a Northern Ireland that is free from sectarian and racial hatred, where all are equal under the law and where people live together in harmony. Sadly, despite the improved times in which we live, tensions still exist across society and are often just beneath the surface.

The programme for cohesion, sharing and integration is out for consultation. It is a genuine effort to bring about the sort of changes that we need. I regret that the SDLP has felt it necessary to throw a spanner in the works by proposing this divisive motion.

I believe in civil and religious liberty for all, and I try to be a good neighbour to all. However, I am not convinced that those who tabled the motion share my commitment to those principles. Indeed, the SDLP’s track record points in the opposite direction. The SDLP is good at talking the talk, but it is not so good at walking the walk. It is the party that joined Sinn Féin, the Alliance Party and the Green Party last October to demand that an Executive Minister sacrifice his right to religious conscience. It is the party that supported 50:50 recruitment to the PSNI, thus denying equality of opportunity to many capable young Protestants. It is the party that attacked my colleague Lord Bannside for exercising his right to protest against the papal visit in Scotland. It is the party that wants to deny Protestants the right to exercise civil and religious liberty on the streets of our Province. It is the party that says that we must hold on to the Parades Commission, which is a body that has a dreadful track record of bias against my community. I will take no lectures from the SDLP on equality or good relations. Before it comes to the House with its fine-sounding words, it really needs to put its house in order.

Like many people in Northern Ireland, I am concerned about the growth of the equality industry. Surely no other region in Europe has the same amount of equality legislation and number of quangos that we have in Northern Ireland. That is hard to justify on the grounds of value for money. More importantly, we have to ask whether the equality industry is actually delivering. The people whom I represent do not feel that their rights are protected.

As I said, the programme for cohesion, sharing and integration offers an opportunity for the way forward. It offers a way to resolve some of the outstanding issues. Rather than attacking the CSI strategy, let us use it as a platform to build on. I oppose the motion.

Basil McCrea (UUP, Lagan Valley)

I am grateful to Danny Kennedy, who has allowed me to say a few words. I want to dispel any myths that are going around here. I am not used to speaking to such a small audience; however, I will do my best.

I wanted to address my comments to friends and colleagues and to esteemed Sinn Féin Assembly Members. I am looking for them, and, unless Barry McElduff is hiding round there, I cannot see any of them. That just shows how important this topic is to Sinn Féin. Nevertheless, I will address some of the comments that Ms Anderson in particular made — [Interruption.] Hold on a tick. Here we go — reinforcements have arrived. For one minute, I thought that I would have to talk to myself. It would not have been the first time that I have done that.

I would like to put forward some really important issues. I listened intently to the speeches in the debate. I find it strange when people say, as Sinn Féin tried to argue, that there must be equality above all else. Surely, need must come into it. Surely, if someone is in dire straits and has an absolutely obvious case for help, we should help them first, regardless of whether they are Catholic or Protestant, white or black, from these shores or not. Surely, the whole essence of civilization and having a responsible attitude is to look after those who are in most need. I am not saying that equality is not important: I am saying that it is just one of a collection of needs that we have to try to address.

John McCallister (UUP, South Down)

I am grateful to the Member for making a contribution to such a small audience. Does he agree that we focus on equality too much? We have some of the most robust equality legislation and measures in the European Union, probably, yet we also have one of the most divided societies in the European Union. We are not going to achieve everything by equality alone.

Basil McCrea (UUP, Lagan Valley)

The Member makes the useful point that we should be looking at outcomes. Can we find a way of doing more than issuing just nice words? I heard Mr Spratt speak most eloquently on the subject. The issue is highlighted by looking at the official position, which concerns how we treat people, regardless of race, background, sexual orientation or any other circumstance. Mr Spratt repeatedly said that we have to address such issues, not just by word but by deed. We have to show our society that we are prepared to work together, that there is a real issue about leadership being shown by those of us in the Assembly and beyond.

I take this opportunity — I hope that I do not speak out of turn with my party colleagues — to say that there has been a lot of discussion of late in the press about various issues. Certainly, Tom Elliott and I have discussed such matters, and I want to put it on the record that Tom works extremely hard in his constituency to bring communities and people from all backgrounds together. He really works at that, and anybody who tries to make mischief out of such things completely misunderstands and misrepresents the reality on the ground.

The issue that I have with the motion and the reason why I stand before you is to say that I believe absolutely in a shared future because I think that it will make all of us stronger. In another place, I argued that, from my political perspective, the Union is stronger when it is a Union for everybody. We should seek to bring people together in our tent to tell them that their contribution is welcome.

Few people have a monopoly on the issue. It is not something about which one party can say that it is the party of equality, of equal opportunity or of this, that and the other. It is about collectivism, it is something that we must do together because that makes us all stronger. We all felt a little sympathy for Danny Kinahan during his speech because we have all experienced not quite getting our papers together. However, Members who listened to what he said heard a first-rate speech that all of us could support. Given the opportunity, I advocate continually that we need to see leadership from the Chamber — genuine leadership — and some form of generosity of spirit. It is a mistake for people to sometimes try to make a party political issue out of a matter that is all-embracing.

Way before my time to speak is up, I will conclude by saying that we will support the amendment and the motion, but we will do so on the basis of the good intent that has been expressed by Members in the debate. Perhaps, all of us could use language a little better; however, collectively, we are the better for it.

Dolores Kelly (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Upper Bann)

Our party will support the Alliance Party amendment, which not only adds to the motion but serves to highlight the deficiencies in the CSI strategy.

It is most alarming that reconciliation is not mentioned once in the strategy. It is even more alarming to hear Martina Anderson’s comments. I am glad that she has now joined us. Where in republicanism was apartheid ever mentioned? They are trying to create a North that, according to their ideal, is separate but equal. Perhaps that explains to some extent why there are more peace walls throughout the North. Perhaps we should simply build peace walls around all our towns and villages to segregate communities, because that appears to be Martina Anderson and Sinn Féin’s vision.

Martina Anderson (Sinn Féin, Foyle)

Will the Member give way?

Dolores Kelly (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Upper Bann)

Not just yet; I will give way later. I wish to address a few other points that Ms Anderson made. She challenged the SDLP about what it has done. We have done quite a lot. Where, in fact, were Martina and her comrades in the 1960s, 1970s and 1980s, when the SDLP was arguing for a reconciled North of Ireland? Where were they when we said that the only way to build equality and good relations was through peaceful political dialogue and not through violence? We welcome the fact that, in parts, Sinn Féin is on the same page as the SDLP today. However, it has performed more U-turns than the Iron Lady. Sinn Féin has much to explain to the nationalist community.

Sinn Féin also has much to explain to the section 75 groups that are not mentioned in the strategy. Sinn Féin cannot have it both ways. Either, as Robin Newton said yesterday, it is a strategy to deal with sectarianism and racism, or it is not. When Sinn Féin and the DUP produced the document, they said that it related to all sections of society and would create a better, fairer and more inclusive Northern Ireland. Yet, outside of their contributions and proposals, young people are abysmally and appallingly dealt with in the document. Victims are not mentioned at all. People who live in marginalised areas and feel marginalised as members of society are not represented. There is no mention of people with disabilities. The document contains no response on gender identity and nothing for the LGBT sector. Indeed, women are excluded entirely from the strategy. Therefore, it is rich of Sinn Féin to point to section 75, when it is clear that it has no understanding of what section 75 is about.

I listened to Daithí McKay, who comes from a constituency that includes Rasharkin, which is hardly a prime example of how people can live in a spirit of good relations and equality. It is win or lose, and, currently, all the people of Rasharkin are losers, because their problems are not being dealt with. We are not giving political leadership, and we are not building a shared and reconciled society.

The Good Friday Agreement was about reconciliation and finding a better way forward. On behalf of the SDLP, I say that the cohesion, sharing and integration strategy should have been about the solidarity that must exist among all people who live here. We must have interdependence among all people who live here, because, without going forward together, we will not go forward at all. Therefore, the strategy must include everyone. As I outlined, however, significant sections of our society are excluded entirely from the cohesion, sharing and integration strategy. I remind Members that it is almost a year since Sinn Féin produced its own version of the strategy following its little spat with the DUP on the subject.

In tabling the motion, the SDLP is intent on building a reconciled future. Margaret Ritchie, in her campaign for party leader, made it one of her main commitments. She made it clear that it was one of the main pillars on which she would base her efforts to take our party and the community forward. No voices from the wider society are being heard, yet people who attended the consultation meetings are champions of the cohesion, sharing and integration strategy.

John Dallat (Social Democratic and Labour Party, East Londonderry)

The Member should bring her remarks to a close.

Dolores Kelly (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Upper Bann)

Sinn Féin should have listened to us a few months ago when it was making a mess of the parades legislation. It should listen to us now and it would not have orange egg all over its face again today.

Robin Newton (DUP, Belfast East)

I am grateful for the opportunity to respond to the debate. I thank the Members who tabled the motion because it has given the Assembly an opportunity to debate the content of the cohesion, sharing and integration consultation document rather than some of the more spurious aspects of the issue that have been thrown around the Chamber today.

I will begin by quoting the document’s opening paragraph:

“We have entered a new and hopeful period in our history. Our vision for this new era is that, working together, we will build a shared and better future for us all. We want to build a society where everyone shares in and enjoys the benefits of a more peaceful society.”

It is a positive statement, which stands in stark contrast to the extremely negative attitude that the SDLP has displayed. The aim of the document, which is our aim, is a shared future: not separate, but equal. The strategy makes clear our aim for shared spaces; shared celebration of cultural expression; and shared neighbourhoods, workplaces and educational opportunities. Executive agreement of the draft programme for cohesion, sharing and integration should be seen as a significant moment in our ongoing effort to build a shared and better future for all. I welcome the opportunity to reiterate its importance and to call on the Assembly, as a whole, to give its full support to the draft programme.

Dolores Kelly mentioned what I said in the House yesterday. I must point out to the Member for Upper Bann that reconciliation is mentioned in the document. I advise her to go away and read the document before she comes to the Assembly to speak on it. I emphasise again what I said in the House yesterday: the SDLP and, indeed, the Ulster Unionists, I am afraid to say, failed to produce anything during their time in the posts of First Minister and deputy First Minister. They could not get agreement, even on a high-level policy, so it is striking to listen to the leader of the SDLP dismiss the Executive consultation document with such disdain. Since she became an MP, she has been taking lessons in how to be more insulting. That is the way in which she came across. She was very professional in her insulting contribution. That negative view exists only in the imagination of the SDLP and has no place in this discourse.

Dolores Kelly (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Upper Bann)

Will the junior Minister give way?

Robin Newton (DUP, Belfast East)

I am sorry, but I have only 15 minutes, and I have to get all my remarks made.

I said yesterday that I had attended several of the public consultation events. Not only did I attend them, but I spoke to at least one third of the audiences at each event before it began. I spoke to individuals, table to table, about their concerns about the consultation document. Therefore, I will not take any lessons on consultation from the SDLP.

It is important to realise that the draft programme is intended only to be a framework document for improved co-ordination of policy across government and the community and voluntary sector. That will ultimately ensure a more efficient, effective and focused response to the challenges of sectarianism and racism. The draft programme for cohesion, sharing and integration sets out a vision for a new era in which all of us can work together to build a shared and better future, a future in which fairness, equality, rights, responsibilities and respect are acknowledged and accepted by all.

Alban Maginness (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast North)

Will the junior Minister give way?

Robin Newton (DUP, Belfast East)

I have only 15 minutes. I agree with the Member for East Belfast Mr Lyttle. It seems that, despite his little time in the Chamber, he has a more thorough grasp of the document than the much more seasoned and mature campaigners on the SDLP Benches, who should be able to analyse documents and put forward arguments, not arguments that are somewhere out of the ether but arguments that are focused on the document and the policy. That makes it even sadder that the Alliance Party has tabled an amendment to the SDLP motion.

The strategy represents a high-level strategic direction, and, once we get agreement on that framework and take into account what we hear during the consultation — I expect to hear lots during the consultation — we will seek final Executive agreement and start to work urgently to develop detailed and robust actions in all the specified areas. Likewise, we recognise all the valuable work and the critical role that is carried out in very difficult times by the Community Relations Council. I challenge Ms Ritchie’s allegation that the Community Relations Council is absent from the strategy. In fact, the CRC appears no fewer than 16 times throughout the document.

Jonathan Bell (DUP, Strangford)

She missed it.

Robin Newton (DUP, Belfast East)

She missed it.

Jimmy Spratt (DUP, Belfast South)

Rose-tinted glasses.

Robin Newton (DUP, Belfast East)

Rose-tinted glasses. I welcome the recognition by my colleagues Mr Spratt and George Robinson that the publication of the strategy has been a significant and positive development in our efforts to tackle the scourges of sectarianism and racism in our community.

Anna Lo (Alliance, Belfast South)

Will the junior Minister give way?

Robin Newton (DUP, Belfast East)

I have already —

John Dallat (Social Democratic and Labour Party, East Londonderry)

Order. The Minister has made it consistently clear that he does not wish to give way. Please respect that.

Robin Newton (DUP, Belfast East)

I speak to all Members of the House when I say that intolerance, prejudice, division, separation, hate and violence cannot be resolved by the publication of one document. This strategy represents a high-level commitment, but everyone in the Chamber and the Assembly needs to work together with the community groups and with each other to continue to bring about real and positive changes on the ground. Indeed, that is particularly true of the party leaders. Peter Robinson, DUP leader, made it clear yesterday during Question Time that this document offers leadership to the entire community. Taking the negative approach will do no one in the community any good. Indeed, that attitude will create further divisions in the community. I do not know what the SDLP’s contribution will be to the consultative process, but I urge it to make a positive rather than a negative response. As Ms Anderson said, the draft programme acknowledges that good relations cannot be built on inequality and that the promotion of equality of opportunity is essential to build good relations.

I welcome Mr Kinahan’s contribution, and, for that reason, I am disappointed to learn that the Ulster Unionists will support the SDLP motion. I welcomed Mr Kinahan’s contribution, which was to say that the Ulster Unionist Party will work constructively to contribute to this process. It is difficult to see how that party can support a motion with such negative content given that, when Mr Kinahan was on his feet, he spoke very positively about supporting the process. I agree with him: we must tackle the deprivation that contributes to bad community relations. However, I reiterate to Mr Kinahan that actions and targets must follow agreement on the overarching strategy. If we are not able to reach and implement a strategy, there is not much sense in having targets.

I will respond to Basil McCrea’s comments. The process has been about trying to identify need and find the appropriate actions to address the need. There is a need to urgently address sectarianism throughout the community and to encourage greater sharing by tackling the barriers to that. That includes not only physical barriers but those that exist in the mindsets of people who would engage in hate crimes, sectarianism and racist activities.

The motion affirms the need for strong political leadership and for independent voices to challenge government to progress lasting change. The draft CSI programme aims to do precisely that. It is a draft document and is not cast in stone. The draft programme sets out plans for the establishment of a ministerial panel, which will be chaired by OFMDFM Ministers and will include all Ministers. Therefore the SDLP, the Ulster Unionist Party, the Alliance Party, Sinn Féin and the DUP will all sit round the table. I assume that they will make a positive contribution. There will be key decision-makers from other statutory agencies and representatives of the community and voluntary sector, and that mechanism will be driven by strong political leadership to progress the work on what are complex and difficult issues and to ensure that it remains at the top of everyone’s agenda. Members will be aware that we have increased funding for work to promote good relations and good relations practice by one third for the period 2008 to 2011. Funding for youth and interface workers has also increased by one quarter.

CSI is a framework. Instead of criticising the draft programme as a whole, I ask Members to see it as a foundation on which we can build a new vision for a shared and better society here that is more cohesive and in which we can respect and tolerate each other’s cultural identity in a context of fairness, equality, respect, rights and accepting our own responsibilities.

John Dallat (Social Democratic and Labour Party, East Londonderry)

As Question Time commences at 2.30 pm, the House should take its ease until that time. The debate will continue after Question Time, when Mr Stephen Farry will make a winding-up speech on the amendment.

The debate stood suspended.

Social Development

David McNarry (UUP, Strangford)

1. asked the Minister for Social Development for an update on the availability of land for affordable housing in the Strangford constituency, particularly in the Comber area. (AQO 149/11)

Alex Attwood (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast West)

I thank the Member for his question. I can confirm that there are a number of sites across the Strangford constituency, many of which the Member will be aware. There are 33 new homes on a site at Dunsy Way, which is being taken forward by the Fold Housing Association. A further site on the Newtownards Road is being taken forward by Connswater Homes, which expects to start work on 12 new homes later this year. There are a range of other sites in the constituency where housing associations have expressed an interest. The Housing Executive and the Department are working with the housing associations to try to put those new homes into future work programmes.

David McNarry (UUP, Strangford)

I thank the Minister for his helpful answer. He used the term “expressed an interest”. What access are housing associations being given to secure land for such projects, for example, land beside Upper Crescent in Comber, of which the Minister should be aware as it is directly beside a recently completed development?

Alex Attwood (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast West)

I am not aware of that particular site, and I will come back to the Member with the details. However, I can confirm that Connswater Homes has an interest in building eight new homes in Londonderry Avenue, and Trinity Housing plans to build 10 new homes on the Belfast Road. Obviously, that is subject to all the necessary approvals and appraisals being completed. All that complements the 50 new homes recently completed at Upper Crescent in Comber by Helm Housing. I think that is what the Member is getting at. The real issue is whether the social housing budget will provide new homes to people in need and disadvantaged communities, and work for those in the construction industry who have no work. Will that budget line have a higher priority and protection in budget negotiations?

Jonathan Bell (DUP, Strangford)

Given that many in Strangford are facing the first elements of repossession, what advice would the Minister’s Department give to people who are struggling with their mortgage arrears, particularly in relation to correspondence on a recent high court judgement? What support can be given to people so that they do not have to leave their homes and go into the social housing market?

Alex Attwood (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast West)

I thank the Member for his timely question. There are three pieces of advice. First, people who find themselves in mortgage difficulties should seek advice immediately. One of the great features of Northern Ireland society is the quality, range and expertise of those who give advice, especially in the independent and community advice sectors. Secondly, my Department, through a scheme run with the Housing Rights Service, gives advice to people in acute mortgage arrears, even at the door of the Chancery Court, in an effort to try to avoid repossession and to deal with the mortgage debt. Thirdly, on a number of occasions, I and my predecessor, Margaret Ritchie, proposed to run a scheme to try to help people in mortgage arrears. That issue was highlighted again yesterday by people in negative equity in the Village area. As far as we can, my Department, the Department of Finance and Personnel (DFP) and the Executive must try to scope out that issue to see whether there are any interventions that might help people in those circumstances.

Kieran McCarthy (Alliance, Strangford)

The Minister spoke about the Comber and Newtownards area. Will he comment on the villages on the peninsula? People in Ballyhalbert have been waiting for about 20 years for six houses, and those in Kircubbin have been waiting for about five years for seven houses. It is the small pockets where we have land —

John Dallat (Social Democratic and Labour Party, East Londonderry)

Question, please.

Kieran McCarthy (Alliance, Strangford)

When will we see houses on the ground in those villages?

Alex Attwood (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast West)

I cannot answer specifically on one site or another at this stage. On a general note, a large number of newbuilds will be built in the Strangford constituency in the coming year. The plan is to build 484 new social homes there, and, although I am unsure whether that will affect the sites that the Member named, that demonstrates that the housing need — it has always been about housing need — is being addressed through the Department’s housing programme.

I do not deny that there will be pockets of need and general need in that constituency. Indeed, there are over 4,700 on the housing transfer list in Strangford, and, of those, 2,500 are in housing stress, with 156 in great need in Comber alone. What all of that demonstrates is that, whatever the top line may be from London during the negotiations for Budget 2011-15, the bottom line must be that those areas of need, be they villages in the Strangford constituency or elsewhere in the North, must be addressed through the budget for newbuild housing.

Trevor Clarke (DUP, South Antrim)

2. asked the Minister for Social Development why his Department changed the criteria which allowed people in receipt of rates relief to benefit from the warm homes scheme. (AQO 150/11)

Alex Attwood (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast West)

I thank the Member for his question. He highlights a particular issue, and his question gives me an opportunity, either on behalf of the Department or the Housing Executive, to hold our hands up. There is an error, which is now being corrected, in the information that has been put out about the warm homes scheme.

In one way, the error was understandable, because it involved a complex and technical matter. Rates relief is given to people in the private sector who live in properties with excessive rates but who do not qualify for the warm homes scheme because of their income levels. Those who live in private properties and are entitled to make applications under the warm homes scheme qualify for rates rebate, which is different from rates relief. As a result of that difference and the misunderstanding and confusion that arose over it, there was, as I understand it, an error made in the information about access to the warm homes scheme. That error is now being corrected. However, a more important point is that the qualifying criteria that were laid down in 2009 have not changed one iota over the past couple of years. Yes, I am currently reviewing the warm homes scheme, but the qualifying criteria have not changed. I apologise for the mistake that was made.

Trevor Clarke (DUP, South Antrim)

Rates relief/benefit was one of the qualifying criteria for the warm homes scheme, and people in private homes who may be living in fuel poverty have been discriminated against because they cannot apply for the scheme.

Alex Attwood (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast West)

As I said, rates relief is not a qualifying benefit or entitlement for accessing the warm homes scheme, the reason being that it is a consequence of high rates being paid by homeowners rather than them necessarily being on low incomes. There is a difference.

The warm homes scheme has been very successful, and I hope to be able to tweak and develop it over the next number of years. If money is to be spent on the scheme to deal with the up to 30% of people who are already in fuel poverty and the 40% plus who could be in it this year and next, it seems highly appropriate that that money should be targeted. The best group to target is those who live in low-income households, who are just beyond the threshold for housing benefit and who get rates relief. Targeting those moneys at those who are in the greatest need and on those levels of incomes seems to be a more judicious and proportionate use of resources.

Paul Maskey (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

Go raibh maith agat, a LeasCheann Comhairle. I appreciate that the Minister has stated that he made a mistake, but he has not told us when that mistake will be rectified. That is an important point, because there are those, including elderly people in his own constituency, who are being pushed into fuel poverty. When will that issue be addressed? Will the Minister rectify the situation as soon as possible?

Alex Attwood (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast West)

I did not concede that I had made a mistake: I accepted that a mistake was made between the Department and/or the Housing Executive. I am accountable, as Minister, and, therefore, I accept the responsibility. I may not have made the mistake personally, but it comes back to me in my collective capacity.

People are not being pushed into fuel poverty because of this matter. The qualifying criteria for the warm homes scheme have not changed. Therefore, the mistake had no bearing on any individual application to the warm homes scheme. In that regard, the Member is in error. The real issue is that three factors give rise to fuel poverty; income, suitable home insulation and the cost of heating. Those are the three factors that drive people into fuel poverty. Fuel poverty is not a consequence of an error in a document. It is a consequence of those three factors.

If we are to have a Budget that is fit for purpose, and that lives up to the needs of those living in fuel poverty, disadvantage, stress, alienation and deprivation, the Executive have to make a value choice — every party and every Minister have to make a choice — that, when it comes to the warm homes scheme, we will not only protect the budget line but enhance it, so that, when we have a Budget, it is a Budget that protects those in need. That is the real issue. It is not a question of an error in one word; it is a question about a fundamental value choice. I hope that the Member, and all Members, will answer that question positively.

Billy Armstrong (UUP, Mid Ulster)

Will the Minister update the House on the potential introduction of a boiler replacement scheme?

Alex Attwood (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast West)

I thank the Member for that very important question. A boiler scrappage scheme was announced by the London Government. However, that scheme did not apply to Northern Ireland. During the consultation on taking the warm homes scheme forward, which finished last week, I put in a question explicitly about the boiler scrappage scheme. In my budget bid, I have said that I would like part of the warm homes scheme, which I referred to in my answer to Mr Maskey’s question, to include a boiler scrappage scheme. However, any scheme that I recommend will not be based on the model used in England, which took a first come, first served approach. If there is going to be a boiler scrappage scheme here, it needs to be based on the broader criteria of those who are in most need and those who would enjoy most advantage. That is the sort of scheme that I intend to take forward, and I hope to make an announcement about that in the near future.

Mary Bradley (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Foyle)

Will the Minister give an assessment of how the warm homes scheme has contributed to the alleviation of fuel poverty?

Alex Attwood (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast West)

I thank the Member for her answer. [Interruption.] Let me repeat that: I thank the Member for her question.

I can confirm that, in the previous financial year, because of the work of Margaret Ritchie, the Department, the Housing Executive and others, we exceeded our target and assisted more than 9,000 households with energy efficiency improvements. That is devolution working on behalf of those in need. At the time when people made their applications and were assessed for the warm homes scheme, they also got a benefit check. Therefore, as a consequence, there may have been a greater take-up of benefit entitlement by those in need.

In this financial year, £20·5 million has been committed to tackling fuel poverty. However, the issue is whether I will have £20·5 million, or more, next year, so that another 9,000 people, or more, can qualify under the scheme.

Paul Butler (Sinn Féin, Lagan Valley)

3. asked the Minister for Social Development whether expected budget restrictions will impact on the delivery of Egan contracts in the near future. (AQO 151/11)

Alex Attwood (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast West)

We cannot anticipate whether there will be further changes to the in-year budgetary situation because there are still six months of the financial year to come, and there may be further budgetary pressures on the Northern Ireland Executive in that period. However, in the absence of further changes, and if we are able to roll out the Budget, and the Egan-style contracts in particular, as we anticipate at the beginning of the financial year, £30 million will be allocated to Egan-style contracts for a significant number of maintenance and repair works. Subject to that caveat, that is what I intend to do, and I anticipate that it will happen.

Paul Butler (Sinn Féin, Lagan Valley)

I thank the Minister for his answer. I understand that the Minister met those involved in the Egan contracts recently. He is aware that any reduction in the money available to the Egan contracts would impact greatly not only on those whom they employ but on many small businesses that avail themselves of the moneys that come from his Department. I am glad that he is not rolling over in the current climate of Tory cuts, and I hope that he will fight any reduction in his budget. I also hope that he has taken on board the fact that the Egan contracts play an important role in the housing sector.

Alex Attwood (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast West)

I appreciate what the Member said. He will appreciate that, given that nearly 40,000 people are on the housing transfer list, of whom almost 20,000 are in housing need, my priority and that of Margaret Ritchie is the building of new social homes. I welcome the Member’s indication that he supports me in protecting my budget lines; I hope that that sentiment will prevail over the next number of months and years.

I was pleased to meet the Egan contractors. I have ensured, and I make no apology for doing so, that the release of moneys for Egan-style contracts is conducted at a proportionate pace over the course of the year. There was the potential for far too much money to be released earlier in the year, which would have given rise to a situation in the latter months of the financial year in which there would be no money or new contracts. The release of money on a phased basis — £19 million of a £30 million budget had been released by the middle of September — seems to me to be a proportionate and reasonable release of moneys to provide the much-needed improvements to people’s homes.

Dominic Bradley (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Newry and Armagh)

Go raibh maith agat, a LeasCheann Comhairle. Gabhaim buíochas leis an Aire as na freagraí a thug sé go dtí seo. Will the Minister detail the funding that has been available to the Egan contracts over the past two years?

Alex Attwood (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast West)

I thank the Member for his question. As I said, the budget line is £30 million, of which £19 million was released in the first six months of this financial year. There is a balance of £11 million to be released. I expect that that will be released and that the full budget line will be discharged. That is on top of the £40 million that was released for Egan-style contracts last year. Given the situation on which Saville reported, namely that 0·2% of social housing in the Housing Executive sector was unfit, that is a measure of the Housing Executive’s commitment to maintaining its housing stock and ensuring that people have homes of a decent standard.

Alastair Ross (DUP, East Antrim)

The Minister may be aware that people living in 40 or 50 homes in the Monkstown estate were under the impression that they would benefit from new schemes for replacement windows and kitchens this year. Those people have now been informed that they could be waiting for up to three years. I know that the Minister has agreed to visit Monkstown and meet some of those residents. Is he able to give any assurance that he may be able to bring some good news when he visits?

Alex Attwood (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast West)

I went out of my way to ensure that I had the opportunity to visit Monkstown. I used to travel through the Monkstown and Rathcoole estates on my way to school years ago, so I am very familiar with the area. I am glad to accept Mr Ross’s invitation to visit.

I will have to come back to the Member on the issues of replacement windows and the like, but my predecessor and I are not minded to go down the road of multi-element schemes for Housing Executive stock — the Housing Executive carrying out a large number of improvements to every property in a locality. We are trying to protect the budget lines that the Member talks about for new windows, improving home insulation, new boilers and new kitchens. Such budget lines are a proper use of the public purse rather than multi-element schemes, which upgraded all properties, regardless of whether they were in the same level of need.

P J Bradley (Social Democratic and Labour Party, South Down)

4. asked the Minister for Social Development for his assessment of the impact of UK welfare reform proposals in Northern Ireland, in the next three years. (AQO 152/11)

Alex Attwood (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast West)

I thank the Member for his question. It is timely, given that yesterday afternoon at 5.00 pm, I left my latest meeting with the Welfare Minister, Lord Freud, in London. The detail will be aired more fully in the debate that will follow Question Time, but there are two strategic issues and threats to welfare and to those who are on benefits in the North. In the longer term, it will be the outcome of Iain Duncan Smith’s consultation on twenty-first century reform of the welfare benefits system. I anticipate that the fog will clear on 20 October, by which stage we will know where the balance of power will lie in the Department for Work and Pensions and the Treasury on the future shape of welfare. I will reserve comment on that until the debate on the issue.

The second issue is the immediate period between now and the end of this financial year and the next two years before welfare benefit reform might be imposed in 2013. I raised a range of issues yesterday with Lord Freud, including cold weather payments, the change in mortgage interest rates for people on benefits, the extension of the 2009 mortgage relief scheme, which is due to end in January, and the migration of people from incapacity benefit to employment and support allowance (ESA) and how that could adversely affect people who are legitimately ill and on benefits. Northern Ireland is still in recession, and it will continue to be so until 2012. There may be fewer public sector jobs, and we face the possibility of a double dip in the neighbouring economy in the Republic of Ireland. Through no fault of their own, people are not in work; therefore how can they be penalised, given the adverse economic conditions in Northern Ireland? That conundrum, that inconsistency and that threat to people on benefits are at the heart of my negotiations with Lord Freud, Iain Duncan Smith and his colleagues.

P J Bradley (Social Democratic and Labour Party, South Down)

I hope that the Minister does not ask me to repeat all that he told me. Will the expected cost associated with welfare reform be adequately reflected in the forthcoming Budget?

Alex Attwood (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast West)

We do not know the anticipated costs for the roll-out of welfare reform, although we will know them in the near future. However, the question is appropriate because all the figures suggest that a big change to the welfare system would cost excessive amounts upfront. Therefore, if the London Treasury and Iain Duncan Smith get their way for a radical shake-up of the welfare benefits system, vast sums of money will have to be paid upfront to put it in place.

If something will cost that much money up front at a time when we have been told that there is less money generally, it seems that the inevitable and logical consequence will be more savings up front in headline benefit rates. That seems the natural conclusion of the conversation that appears to be taking place between the Treasury and the Department for Work and Pensions. Although the Treasury says that it will fund a radical shake-up of the benefits system, it will penalise the Department in respect of benefits rates. The bottom line is that that will impact on a vast number of people in Northern Ireland.

Mickey Brady (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

Go raibh maith agat, a LeasCheann Comhairle. The Minister has already mentioned people on benefits who have problems paying their mortgages. A large number of people who get help with their mortgages and are in receipt of benefits have already been affected. Does the Minister accept that people’s homes could be in danger? Will he explain to the House whether he intends to take action sooner rather than later? Obviously, we await the outcomes of various negotiations and talks about budgets, and so on. A large number of people are already in danger of losing their homes.

Alex Attwood (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast West)

I thank the Member for his question. My reply has two elements. The first concerns policy, which I mentioned earlier. Yesterday, I argued with Lord Freud that the Labour Government’s 2009 assistance scheme for people who became unemployed and had difficulty in paying their mortgages should be extended beyond January 2011, when it is due to finish. Furthermore, I argued that the reduction in the rate of mortgage interest that would be paid by people who are on benefits and still paying a mortgage — given that there will be a reduction of the interest rate payment to around 3·65% — would result in 7,000 people in Northern Ireland being penalised. I said that that was unjust, inequitable and would penalise people who are trying to keep their homes in a way that would put them under further financial pressure and result in the loss of their homes.

In respect of the second element, I refer to my previous answer. Dozens of people have been helped by money that we have put into housing rights to help those who, often, are at the doors of the court and face repossession. I believe that we have been able to help around 15% of people who have appeared before the chancery division to avoid repossession, but I will verify that figure. If it is correct, it suggests that that is a useful intervention. Let us build on that. Let us provide additional money for mortgage protection schemes, which the Executive have not funded to date, and for housing rights advice to enable people who get into debt to better manage their funds and to better negotiate with their building society or bank to reduce the stress that they are in.

Gerry McHugh (Independent, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

Go raibh maith agat, a LeasCheann Comhairle. Can the Minister tell me why much welfare reform attacks less-well-off people and, indeed, the National Health Service, which was the envy of Europe because it provided support from cradle to grave? It will now need to be paid for from conception to grave. That attack is aimed at less-well-off people in particular.

Alex Attwood (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast West)

I broadly concur with that sentiment. Whatever spin the Treasury puts on the emergency Budget, the hard and cold fact is that a middle-of-the-road organisation, the Institute for Fiscal Studies, concluded that the emergency Budget in June had a disproportionate impact on the poor. Around four weeks ago, the BBC confirmed that research that it commissioned showed that areas of Northern Ireland and Britain that relied heavily on the public sector would suffer disproportionately when it comes to public service cuts. That is pretty self-evident.

The TUC’s recent research confirmed that all indications, particularly reports that the Chancellor was trying to cut an extra £4 billion from the benefits system, would have a disproportionate impact on poor, needy and disadvantaged people. Therefore, I conclude that there is still a Tory wolf in the London Government, who masquerade as a coalition Government in grey suits.

If we do not measure up to the negotiation with London over the next number of weeks on minimising welfare impact on the North and maximising the budget, that situation might deepen.

Agriculture and Rural Development

Alastair Ross (DUP, East Antrim)

1. asked the Minister of Agriculture and Rural Development for her assessment of the level of funding currently committed under axis 3 of the rural development programme. (AQO 164/11)

Michelle Gildernew (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

Go raibh maith agat, a LeasCheann Comhairle. Resources to the value of some £12·5 million have been committed in letters of offer that have been issued under axis 3 of the rural development programme. That is across all six measures within the axis, including farm diversification, tourism, rural business and village renewal. In addition, a further £9·7 million of grants have been approved, and letters of offer are being prepared. Therefore, a total of £22·2 million has been committed, so far, in the axis. It is worth noting that in excess of £15·4 million of that £22·2 million has been committed in this financial year. Although that is good news, I am not complacent.

It is my strong belief that axis 3 spend needs to be increased significantly, and I am concerned about the slow progress of that axis compared with the rest of the rural development programme. The progress has been slow, despite the fact that we have made available a very large amount of financial resources for the administration of axis 3. Nevertheless, it appears that large numbers of applications are not moving to letter of offer stage quickly enough. Additionally, some applications are being withdrawn, and the local action groups do not always know why. All of that has led to a disappointing amount of funds going to rural communities by way of hard cash. That is not satisfactory. I have asked my officials to find out what and where the blockages are and to report back to me as a matter of urgency.

The Member will know that, when I set up the local action groups, I asked councils to look after the administration and finance. At that time, the review of public administration was imminent, and we were expecting that there would be a solid agreed cluster of councils, which would be in a position to look after the axis and to integrate it into a new and innovative local government structure. That has not happened. The clusters are a loose amalgam within the current 26-council structure. It is right, therefore, to assess the viability of continuing with such a system, and I intend to do so. My main concern, however, is to ensure that those funds get to the rural communities who need assistance, particularly in this difficult economic climate. I will look critically at the working of the axis. I have asked officials to produce the relevant facts and figures for me, and I will not shirk from the hard decisions that will ensure that the funding gets to the people for whom it is meant as quickly as possible.

Alastair Ross (DUP, East Antrim)

I thank the Minister for her comprehensive answer. She alluded to the disappointment in the rural community over how funding is getting to the people. What is the projected spend for the closure of the project in 2011? If all the moneys are not spent by the end of the project, will they be rolled over to a new scheme, or will they have to be returned to Europe?

Michelle Gildernew (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

I assure the Member and the House that I do not intend to hand money back to Europe. At this point, it is my absolute desire to see all the money identified for axis 3, which is £100 million, to be spent within that axis. Therefore, it is appropriate and timely to review progress to ensure that everything that can be done is being done or that we change things in time to get the spend out, if change is needed. I am also looking at the other challenges that exist in getting match funding from the banks, for instance, and at whether planning permission is a problem. I recognise that there are complex reasons why people do not progress to letter of offer stage, but I will look at those in great detail and do everything that I can to ensure that whatever decisions need to be made to get to that magic figure of £100 million will be made.

Billy Leonard (Sinn Féin, East Londonderry)

Go raibh maith agat, a LeasCheann Comhairle. How much of the money committed is for investment in farm diversification? How much has been spent?

Michelle Gildernew (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

I am having difficulty finding the correct notes; that shows how organised I am. Gabh mo leithscéal, a LeasCheann Comhairle. I apologise to the Member. Farm families have welcomed the opportunity to increase farm incomes through diversification projects, and the measure is becoming well subscribed.

To date, 172 letters of offer have been issued for diversification projects to a value of over £4 million. Projects are moving ahead, and almost £1 million has already been spent on them. That is where we see the benefits of axis 3, which include creating more work on farms and creating the possibility of further employment. Some of my best days out have been to farm diversification projects around all constituencies, where I have seen how innovative and creative our rural communities can be in bringing forward ideas that benefit not only our tourism potential but the services that are available for local rural communities.

Patsy McGlone (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Mid Ulster)

Go raibh maith agat, a LeasCheann Comhairle. Gabhaim buíochas leis an Aire as ucht an fhreagra sin. I thank the Minister for her answer. She, quite rightly, identified slow progress. Will she explain how much of that slow progress was on the part of the Department? I remember from my time on the Committee that we had inordinate waits for the Department to make progress in getting money and investment out into the community so that we could see development and jobs being created. Can the Minister clarify whether the criteria were tweaked or changed by the Department during their evolution?

Michelle Gildernew (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

As I have said many times in the House, I am determined to cut bureaucracy from my Department, and that includes in this scheme. However, money spent in axis 3 is public money, and the Member will know that it is money that comes not only from the Assembly but from Europe, and the Commission, as we heard yesterday, demands tight inspections and controls. I have given the House an undertaking that I will ensure that, if there are hiccups caused by my Department, I will find them, wherever they are, and — to use the word that the Member used — I will tweak the scheme to ensure that there are no difficulties at Department level.

Given the history of the scheme, the fact that the RPA was not as successful as we had hoped it would be has probably led to some difficulties. I know that there are very good people working on the scheme. As a European obligation, it is a bottom-up scheme. I accept that it has taken longer than I would have liked to get that scheme up and running properly, but I am hoping that the pace will take off now and that we will get more letters of offer out and get hard cash into the communities that need it most.

Roy Beggs (UUP, East Antrim)

Given that axis 3 and axis 1 funding involves rural development and economic development in the countryside through tourism, community development, good relations etc and that, as the Minister has said, the RPA failed to go through, how is she ensuring that duplication — the structures do not match together — is avoided in local government and confusion is avoided, so that we get value for money with this expenditure?

Michelle Gildernew (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

That is why I am looking at the progress that has been made to date. If there has been duplication, I want to know about it, and I will undertake a wide-ranging review to ensure that no unnecessary levels to go through are preventing spend on projects. I recognise that it took a while to get us where we want to be. If we do not see those schemes going ahead, I will be asking why. It is important that people who come forward with good ideas get the support that they need from the local action groups, the joint council committees and the Department to ensure that their ideas are progressed, they get the letters out and they spend the money to benefit not only the rural community, through making services available, but the rural economy.

John Dallat (Social Democratic and Labour Party, East Londonderry)

The Member who tabled question 2 is not in his place.

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

3. asked the Minister of Agriculture and Rural Development to outline her plans for her departmental budget over the forthcoming comprehensive spending review period. (AQO 166/11)

Michelle Gildernew (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

As the House is aware, the prospects for the public finances are very difficult, given that the British Government have made tackling the fiscal deficit their number-one priority. DFP has made a number of working assumptions about the level of cuts that might be needed to balance the books and fund cost pressures. I have been given the opportunity to submit bids for new proposals and pressures, and I have done so. At the Executive, we have already had discussions about the evolving Budget position. I expect that to continue into the autumn and beyond before the funding decisions can be made. We have begun to plan internally, but it is too early at this stage to say how we will deliver any savings that the Executive finally decide on.

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

How much further into the future does the Department need to project to take into account the risk of a further EU disallowance in relation to single farm payments? Is that not a major opportunity cost problem in the context of a tight public expenditure round?

Michelle Gildernew (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

The issue of disallowance was covered significantly yesterday, as was the fact that the impact of the disallowance will not be felt by DARD’s budget. As the Member knows, we have bid for an amount, and the CSR period runs over four years. Many of us talked to the trade unions that were in the Building today about how we can fight cuts and try to work together. I know that the First Minister and deputy First Minister are in London today to speak to the Chancellor. It is important that we fight cuts as best we can. I assure the Member that internal planning is being undertaken, but it will be some weeks before we are ready to make those plans public. It would be imprudent of me to offer up savings that might have a knock-on effect that damages the rural economy when I might not have to offer up those savings at all.

Barry McElduff (Sinn Féin, West Tyrone)

Go raibh maith agat, a LeasCheann Comhairle. Will the Minister detail her Department’s attitude to the possible relocation of its headquarters? I wish to flag up Omagh as a suitable location. I know that my colleague Martina Anderson has often flagged up Orchard House as a suitable location for any expansion project. However, Sperrin House and Omagh have a strong public sector tradition. Will the Minister outline her views on the matter?

Michelle Gildernew (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

Anybody who has ever been to our headquarters at Dundonald House will be aware that the building is coming to the end of its useful life. During the Budget period, I anticipate that new accommodation will need to be identified. That presents the Executive with an opportunity to address the recommendations in the Bain report on the relocation of public sector jobs and to consider the benefits of ensuring that quality public sector jobs are available in rural communities.

It would be symbolic and practical if the Executive addressed the recommendation that at least one departmental HQ should be considered for relocation, and the report identified DARD’s headquarters as the most suitable option in that respect. However, I do not want to get involved in a fight between Ms Anderson and Mr McElduff about where the headquarters should be located. That is one decision that I hope that I do not have to make. If relocation goes ahead during this CSR period, it would genuinely benefit rural communities.

P J Bradley (Social Democratic and Labour Party, South Down)

As food production remains one of our key industries, what assurance will the Minister give that those involved in production and processing cycles will be given special protection by her Department in the forthcoming spending review?

Michelle Gildernew (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

I can give the Member absolutely no assurance about that, given the cuts that we are looking at and the savings that the Executive will have to make. It would be absolutely foolish of me to stand here and say that we intend to ring-fence a certain sector. We must look at everything. Nothing is not on the table, and difficult decisions must be made. It would not be right if I stood up here today and said that I was going to ring-fence a certain sector in my Department. However, what I can say to the House is that I am absolutely committed to protecting front line services for the benefit of famers and rural communities.

Danny Kennedy (UUP, Newry and Armagh)

Given that it is anticipated that the Minister’s Department will see a £10 million year-on-year reduction, will she detail precisely what savings she envisages her Department being able to make before any cutbacks impact on front line services?

Michelle Gildernew (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

As the Member is aware, delivering savings of that magnitude will be difficult for DARD, given that so much of what my Department does is either a statutory obligation or a direct service to our customers. The savings proposals that I will consult on must be realistic and sustainable, and it is important to get them right. I want the savings proposals to be as fully formed as possible before I consult stakeholders. I am aware that identifying options for savings could alarm customers and staff, and I do not want to cause concern by releasing material prematurely or by putting forward options that will not be needed. Rest assured that, when I am ready to release material, I will consult rural stakeholders and take account of their views.

Anna Lo (Alliance, Belfast South)

4. asked the Minister of Agriculture and Rural Development for an update on the disallowances levied in relation to single farm payments. (AQO 167/11)