Northern Ireland Assembly, 17 September 2013

284 contributions from 63 members. The official report.

Assembly Business

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

Before we move to this morning's business, I wish to make an announcement to the House. I have been notified by the Sinn Féin nominating officer that Ms Sue Ramsey has been replaced as Chairperson of the Committee for Health, Social Services and Public Safety by Ms Maeve McLaughlin, with effect from 16 September 2013. Ms McLaughlin has accepted the nomination. I am content that the requirements of Standing Orders have been met, and I therefore confirm that Ms Maeve McLaughlin took up office as Chairperson of the Committee for Health, Social Services and Public Safety with effect from yesterday.

Ministerial Statements

Martin McGuinness (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle. Mr Speaker, in compliance with section 52C(2) of the Northern Ireland Act 1998, we wish to make a statement on the sixteenth meeting of the North/South Ministerial Council (NSMC) in plenary format, which was held in Dublin on Friday 5 July 2013, immediately before the Assembly went into recess. The Executive Ministers who attended the meeting have agreed that we may make this report on their behalf.

Our delegation was led by the First Minister, Peter Robinson MLA, and myself. The following Executive Ministers were also in attendance: Minister Attwood, Minister Farry, Minister Kennedy, Minister Ní Chuilín, Minister O'Dowd, Minister O'Neill, Minister Poots, junior Minister Bell and junior Minister McCann.

The Irish Government delegation was led by the Taoiseach, Enda Kenny TD. The following Irish Government Ministers were also in attendance: Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs and Trade, Eamon Gilmore, Minister Noonan, Minister Howlin, Minister Bruton, Minister Burton, Minister Deenihan, Minister Rabbitte, Minister Coveney and Minister Fitzgerald.

At our meeting, the Council discussed a broad range of issues facing both jurisdictions. The July meeting came just a few weeks after the very successful G8 summit in Fermanagh. Ministers welcomed the positive impact that the summit made and recognised the need to build on its success. In that context, we looked ahead to the World Police and Fire Games in August, which turned out to be another hugely successful event for us, and to the continuing efforts to promote tourism through the City of Culture and "The Gathering".

The plenary session also provided a valuable opportunity to exchange views on the fiscal challenges that we face. In particular, Ministers discussed the challenges facing the local banking sector and recognised the need to cooperate on bank restructuring and the National Asset Management Agency (NAMA).

The opportunities through cooperation of attracting trade and investment from developing markets for both jurisdictions were also discussed. On the back of our successful trips to China and Brazil, we took the opportunity to acknowledge the role of the Irish embassy network in supporting the Executive during those trade visits.

There was a discussion on the new 'Building a Prosperous and United Community' economic package, and it was agreed that both jurisdictions will cooperate on that. The Council welcomed our Together: Building a United Community strategy, which will complement the new Peace programme.

Ministers also discussed the negative impact of illegal fuel on the transport industry, revenue to the exchequers and the environment.

The position on Narrow Water bridge was also discussed by Ministers.

On EU matters, Ministers noted that Ireland’s presidency of the EU had been a great success and that there had been good cooperation between both jurisdictions during the presidency term. The participation of Executive Ministers at presidency-related events and the updates on the presidency, provided at NSMC meetings and by the then Minister of State Creighton to Executive Ministers and MLAs, were welcomed. The Irish Government thanked the Executive for the provision of premises and staff by our office in Brussels and for the provision of seconded staff from the Civil Service.

Ministers noted the implications of the European Council agreement on the multi-annual financial framework, common agriculture policy reform and common fisheries policies, and the impact of transnational EU programmes such as INTERREG and framework programme 7 (FP7), which will become Horizon 2020. They acknowledged the importance of North/South cooperation in accessing EU funds.

The multi-annual financial framework, which has now been agreed by the European Parliament, includes provision for funding of €150 million towards a new Peace programme as part of the new EU budget. Ministers also noted that the size of the programme, including match-funding requirements, will depend on the outcome of programme planning. The draft operational programme plans are being prepared by the Special EU Programmes Body (SEUPB), and finalisation of those will be dependent on agreement on the EU budget and regulations.

Youth unemployment is an issue that impacts on both jurisdictions, and there was a valuable discussion on the actions being taken to tackle it. Ministers noted that the issue is recognised as being of importance across Europe and that various EU-wide initiatives are being implemented to help address youth unemployment levels. Ministers considered the opportunities for collaboration to address this important issue, including through the European Union’s new Youth Guarantee and to work with relevant stakeholders to maximise the impact of the Youth Guarantee.

The plenary session provides an opportunity for Ministers to consider the progress report prepared by the NSMC joint secretaries on the work of the North/South bodies and in the other NSMC areas for cooperation.

The following key developments were highlighted in the joint secretaries report. The business planning case for the establishment of a radiotherapy unit at Altnagelvin hospital is further advanced, and officials are working together to ensure the effective delivery of the project.

A very successful all-island child protection conference was held in May 2013, attended by over 250 delegates. The conference facilitated practitioners, managers, policymakers and legislators from both jurisdictions to share practice knowledge, research, experience and learning on safeguarding and child protection practice.

The two Agriculture Departments continue to cooperate closely in dealing with the ash dieback outbreak.

Ministers affirmed the intention of the Education Departments to work to broaden and deepen their cooperation on education matters and that the stated intentions of part 2 of the joint study on North/South cooperation in education can be achieved as a result of the proposed high-level engagement at official level.

Charging for carrier bags is now in place across the island of Ireland following our recent introduction of the carrier bag levy in April. Progress continues on the mutual recognition of penalty points with the commitment to have the necessary primary and secondary legislation in place by 31 December 2014.

InterTradeIreland hosted a very successful Collaborate to Innovate conference on 23 May in the Croke Park conference centre, which was attended by over 220 delegates. The focus of the conference was on the upcoming expected €70 billion R&D and innovation fund Horizon 2020, which will come on stream in 2014.

At March 2013, in the Peace III programme, 214 projects worth €314 million, which is £283 million, had received letters of offer, and, in the INTERREG IVa programme, 78 projects worth €223 million, which is £194 million, had received letters of offer.

The range of consumer and scientific activities undertaken by the Food Safety Promotion Board includes its work on developing an indicator for measuring food poverty and involvement with the Department of the Environment and the Environmental Protection Agency in a joint campaign focusing on customers’ understanding of best-before and use-by dates.

The Loughs Agency is involved in prominent engagement with the City of Culture, especially in the important promotional opportunity afforded by the partnership with Tate Britain and the Turner Prize. The two agencies of the Language Body continue to collaborate on governance and promotion issues, including the establishment of a committee to oversee the joint work programme, the current consultation process on the joint equality scheme and funding for 'The Honest Sod', which is a play in Ulster-Scots and Irish that has toured 88 schools and has been seen by over 3,000 pupils.

With regard to the Ulster canal, formal planning applications have been granted by Cavan County Council and Clones Town Council. Fermanagh District Council agreed the recommendation for approval and referred it to the Department of the Environment's Planning Service, which has also approved the application. The joint secretaries report also highlighted that a new suite of websites was rolled out by Tourism Ireland designed to capitalise on the growing importance of the internet in travel and holiday planning and to harness the growth in social media.

Ministers noted that the terms of reference 1 for the St Andrews Agreement review is now largely complete, that senior officials have met and initiated a work programme to take forward terms of reference 2 and 3, and that they will conclude their work and present a report with proposals to the next NSMC institutional meeting in the autumn.

Ministers also welcomed the progress that has been made through the north-west gateway initiative on a range of initiatives, which have been delivered and planned, that aim to deliver economic and social benefits in the north-west. They noted that the consultation has commenced with key stakeholders in the north-west on the future development of the north-west gateway initiative and that a report on the outcome of that exercise will be brought to a future NSMC institutional meeting. Ministers noted the current position on a North/South consultative forum and agreed to review the issue at a future NSMC plenary. The Council approved a schedule of NSMC meetings proposed by the joint secretariat.

Mike Nesbitt (UUP, Strangford)

I thank the deputy First Minister for his statement. Yesterday, the Agriculture Minister reported on an NSMC meeting in agriculture format, and the DUP's Mr Buchanan summarised it by saying that the statement notes this and welcomes that but tells us absolutely nothing. Given that the Minister's statement also does a lot of noting and welcoming, is Mr Buchanan right in his criticism?

Martin McGuinness (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

I do not think that it is my responsibility, when reporting on a meeting of the North/South Ministerial Council, to comment on other meetings. The Member may have his own view on the content of reports that are given to this Assembly by other Ministers, but it is certainly not my responsibility to make any comment on that.

Stephen Moutray (DUP, Upper Bann)

I thank the deputy First Minister for the statement. What further steps can be taken to achieve value for money for Northern Ireland from meetings such as this?

Martin McGuinness (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

The first thing that people need to remember is that meetings such as the one that the First Minister, other Ministers and I attended with our counterparts from Dublin would not be happening if they were not of value to the institutions, North and South. It is quite clear that the levels of cooperation across a wide range of ministerial responsibilities are of huge benefit to the institutions. All that happens without compromising anybody's political allegiances; as the Member said, it is about value for money. There are clear examples of how that has been the case, not least with the work of InterTradeIreland, and cooperation on child protection, which, as we all know, has been in the news recently. That is an issue of great concern, and there are circumstances in which people can skip across borders to evade detection and prosecution. It is hugely important that the institutions of government are working closely together.

From a political perspective, the fact that the political institutions, North and South, are working closely together is beneficial for the work in which the customs services and police services, North and South, are involved in detecting people who are engaged in illegal fuel laundering, much of which is seriously detrimental to our environment and our economy and clearly involves criminal activity.

Ever-increasing good work is being done by the police services, North and South, to ensure that those opposed to peace on this island can be neutralised and prevented from carrying out their nefarious deeds.

Bronwyn McGahan (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

Go raibh maith agat. I thank the Minister for his statement. I welcome the development and progress of the all-Ireland child protection conference. However, given recent developments in the news about the serious exploitation of young people in care homes in the North of Ireland, does the joint First Minister agree that this issue needs to be addressed on an all-Ireland basis and to be at the forefront of the North/South Ministerial Council agenda.

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

Order. Before the deputy First Minister answers, let us address Ministers and Members by their proper title. I will continue to warn the whole House about this, even when it comes to the naming of Members in the House. Let us address Ministers in the proper manner.

Martin McGuinness (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

Child protection is hugely important, as we all know, particularly anybody who has been listening to the horrific reports that we have been hearing over the past 24 hours. I am conscious of the fact that there is an ongoing police investigation into the activities of suspected child abusers. It is hugely important that we, in our meetings on a North/South basis, are involved in ensuring that we are up to speed in providing the required child protection safeguards and mechanisms. The fact that we discuss the issue at the NSMC and that there was an all-island child protection conference, which was held in Dundalk, shows that it is an important area of work. It is absolutely vital that we cooperate in this area, so the North/South Ministerial Council will continue to monitor closely the agreed work programme with a cross-border steering group on child protection.

As I said in my earlier answer, it is incumbent on all of us to recognise that child abusers, although they may carry out abuse in any of the six counties in the North, can quite easily on occasions skip across the border and live in any of the other 26 counties. It is important that we work together, not only on a North/South basis but on an east-west basis, because it has long been recognised that we are dealing with a global problem. It is important that we continue to work and to closely support one another as Ministers and support the people who are at the sharp end in dealing with the matter: the police services, North and South. It is vital that we protect our children, and I think that all of us accept that it makes sense to do so on an all-island basis.

Colum Eastwood (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Foyle)

I thank the deputy First Minister for his statement and for his answers so far. I know that he will join me in saying that the City of Culture has been a fantastic year for our city. It has been tremendous, and the impact for the people of Derry has been fantastic. What work will the Executive do to develop and ensure a positive legacy for the people of our city, especially given the quite worrying recent unemployment figures in Derry?

Martin McGuinness (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

I thank the Member for raising the City of Culture issue. It came up during the meeting, and we told the Irish Government that the City of Culture celebrations were well under way and that many excellent events had already been hosted.

Since the plenary meeting, there have been numerous other successful events, but I want specifically to highlight the success of the Fleadh Cheoil na hÉireann in August, which was held for the first time in its history in the North. Over eight days, thousands of musicians and visitors packed the streets through playing traditional music. They took over the city with street sessions, fun days, pageants, marching bands, competitions, ceilidh bands, concerts and singing. An assessment of the economic impact of the Fleadh is being undertaken, and it is worth noting that an economic impact assessment of the Cavan Fleadh in 2010 concluded that it generated more than £30 million in direct expenditure in the local economy.

It was a great joy that we attended The Poet and the Piper event in the Millennium Forum with Seamus Heaney and Liam Óg Ó Floinn. Some of us spoke to Seamus after the event, and he was absolutely overjoyed that the city had been designated City of Culture. He was also delighted to have participated in Fleadh Cheoil na hÉireann. Hearing, two weeks later, that he had passed away brought enormous sadness to all of us. The island of Ireland was effectively in mourning for Ireland's greatest poet. It is important that we recognise his contribution as a Nobel Laureate in Literature, someone who made an enormous contribution to all of our lives and a very strong supporter of the peace process. He was very much in favour of unionist and nationalist and republican politicians working together. He once used a great phrase that has always stuck in my mind: working "through-otherness". It is important to recognise his important contribution to Irish life.

I was also delighted that at least four loyalist bands participated in Fleadh Cheoil na hÉireann. At one stage, at one of their contributions, they played 'The Sash' — against advice — and nobody blinked an eyelid. It was a fantastic event and a clear example of how all of us need to work together. I was very pleased to attend a play in honour of a loyalist band. It was not a pipe band, it was a tin whistle band. No, it was a flute band from Newbuildings. Some members of the band participated in the play, and it was an enormous success. It was also an eye-opener for me into a culture that I do not have a lot of knowledge about.

The legacy issue is hugely important. The Minister of Culture, Arts and Leisure has a responsibility to take that forward, and I know that work is in progress. It would be a disaster if we ended up on 31 December, when the City of Culture comes to an end, with nothing in place to take forward a programme of culture in the period ahead. I know that the Minister is exercised about that and is very much involved with the local council and other organisations in the city to ensure that there is a legacy. However, this year has been a fabulous success, and those who deserve the most praise are the people of the city who made their own unique contribution. I include everybody in that, those from the east bank and the west bank.

Chris Lyttle (Alliance, Belfast East)

I thank the deputy First Minister for his statement. We are advised that the meeting of the North/South Ministerial Council welcomed the publication of the Office of the First Minister and deputy First Minister (OFMDFM) community relations strategy, Together: Building a United Community. What is the deputy First Minister's response to Richard Haass's comments that, despite the strategy, the upcoming talks should consider the issue of segregation in our society, particularly in education and housing?

Martin McGuinness (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

The First Minister and I had the opportunity to have a very lengthy meeting with Richard Haass in New York last week. I am delighted that he has now arrived and that many of us will meet him over the coming days.

The important thing is that Richard Haass is an independent chair who was agreed by all the parties in the Assembly. That is of huge significance, because he comes at all this with a tremendous experience and knowledge of the situation here that was gained when he was the United States envoy to our situation. Obviously, they are crucially important talks. The issues that are to be resolved in relation to flags, parades and the past are critical elements on which we have failed to gain agreement over the course of recent times. We have seen how that has played out, particularly in relation to the issue of flags and parades, to our detriment in the course of recent times. I wish Richard Haass every success, and I pledge my party's — and I have no doubt that others will pledge their party's — full intention to work closely with him to find solutions to those difficult issues.

The discussions around integrated education and segregated housing estates have been mentioned by Richard Haass. We will see how those discussions are taken forward. Certainly, in our Together: Building a United Community, there is a very determined intention by the First Minister and me to tackle those issues. If we were, as, I expect, we will do in the course of the coming months and years, to make progress on those issues, we would be well on our way to making huge inroads into removing the unacceptable levels of segregation that exist in our society.

George Robinson (DUP, East Londonderry)

I thank the deputy First Minister for his statement. Will he elaborate on the north-west gateway initiative? Will any economic and social benefits apply to towns such as Limavady, where so many jobs have been lost over a period of time?

Martin McGuinness (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

Obviously, the north-west gateway initiative is hugely important. As I said earlier in my statement, it is quite clear that it is being taken forward in relation to some hugely important matters, not least the construction of the new radiotherapy unit at Altnagelvin Area Hospital.

Limavady and other areas in the north-west, including the city of Derry, are black spots, and Coleraine has also been affected. Those are all issues that are of huge concern to our Executive. The decision of the Agriculture Minister to relocate the headquarters of the Department of Agriculture to Ballykelly is a very clear signal of the Executive's intention to try to target some of the unemployment black spots that exist in the north-west. We will continue to take that work forward in a way that delivers for citizens. However, it is incumbent on me to point out that, whenever large companies take decisions, such as some of the decisions that were taken in Limavady, that create unemployment for many people, it can be very dispiriting for any community or area.

The north-west gateway initiative, the radiotherapy unit, the City of Culture, Project Kelvin, cooperation on out-of-hours medical centres, and a consultation exercise currently under way with key stakeholders about the future direction of the initiative is all to try to improve the lives of the people who live in the north-west on both sides of the border, obviously with a key focus on the unemployment black spots that the Member has just mentioned.

Megan Fearon (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle. I, too, thank the deputy First Minister for his statement. How does his Office intend to deliver on the new European youth guarantee, given that it has had some success in other European countries already in tackling youth unemployment?

Martin McGuinness (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

That was a major topic at not just the North/South Ministerial Council but the British-Irish Council (BIC), which the First Minister and I attend regularly. At this meeting, we had a very useful discussion with the Irish Government. Youth unemployment, Europe wide, is a very serious issue. The economic situation over the past number of years has made it really difficult for our young people to enter the labour market.

We understand that youth unemployment in both jurisdictions and right across Europe is at unacceptable levels, and the European Union has effectively now set aside €8 billion in the European budget to tackle the issue. We discussed whether there was potential for us to work together on this. The Irish Government told us that the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development would be working with them to develop an action plan to increase youth employment, and they have also invited our Minister Farry to be involved in this, which is a very welcome development. Further discussions are continuing on the issue, and we agreed that we will consider the topic again at the next plenary meeting. So, there is a huge emphasis, both at the NSMC and at the BIC, with a particular focus on the €8 billion that Europe has set aside to tackle this issue.

Brenda Hale (DUP, Lagan Valley)

I thank the deputy First Minister for his statement. Given the agreement on the business case for the radiotherapy unit at Altnagelvin hospital, can the deputy First Minister give any further insight into any advancement on the delivery of the project?

Martin McGuinness (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

At the meeting, we noted the position regarding the construction of the new radiotherapy centre. The business planning process is well advanced, with a stage 2 outline business case having been approved in August 2012. A full business case is being developed by the Western Trust and is expected to be submitted to the Department of Health, Social Services and Public Safety (DHSSPS) this month before being referred to the Department of Finance and Personnel (DFP) for approval. The total approved funding for the project is around £65 million, including a capital contribution from the Irish Government's Department of Health of €19 million. Enabling work on the site commenced in June 2012. The design team for the new building started work in January 2012, and the completion and operational date for the unit remains 2016. Officials from both jurisdictions are continuing to work together to ensure that the project remains on target for completion. A draft memorandum of understanding has been agreed and will be signed by all parties shortly. Work has started on developing a service level agreement, so things are now progressing very well indeed.

Phil Flanagan (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle. Gabhaim buíochas leis an Aire as ucht a ráitis. In the Minister's statement, he said that one of the attendees at the meeting was the Tánaiste and Minister for Foreign Affairs and Trade, Eamon Gilmore TD. Shortly after the NSMC meeting, he departed on a two-day visit to Washington to lobby on behalf of the undocumented Irish in America, which is a huge issue for very many people in my constituency and in other areas. Does the deputy First Minister agree that the undocumented Irish in America is an important issue that should be raised at a future meeting of the NSMC or at any other suitable forum?

Martin McGuinness (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

I absolutely do agree that it is a critical issue, given that there are countless examples of a lot of human misery that has been caused because of the inability of people who are regarded as undocumented to travel home for things such as funerals, weddings and baptisms. This House will be aware that this is the subject of major discussion at Capitol Hill. In fact, decisions have been taken by Congress, and the very positive decisions that it has taken on doing something about this now rest with the Senate. We know that President Obama is very proactive and that many senior Republican Senators are also very supportive of doing something about this. So, yes, it is a hugely important issue. When the First Minister and I were in the United States, I was told of a man who has been there for something like 18 years. He is employing 100 people but is one of the undocumented Irish in the United States. This is somebody who making a massive contribution towards the US economy.

We will continue to be focused on the issue, and we wish the Senate well in its deliberations. We do not know how it will turn out, but there is now a big focus on it. It is not only on the plight of people who come from this island. Obviously, the discussions that are taking place on Capitol Hill are much more holistic and much more global, dealing with many other ethnic groups. However, I think that, given the relationship between this island, North and South, and the United States of America, it is incumbent on all of us to ensure that people, whatever community they come from, North and South, can be assisted through what is turning out to be a very difficult situation for them, particularly with the inability to come home at critical times in their family lives.

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

I warn Members that questions should be on the statement before the House this morning, just in case other Members might feel that they want to stray into other avenues.

Patsy McGlone (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Mid Ulster)

Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle. Fanfaidh mé leis an ráiteas. I think I will stick with the statement. Paragraph 13 states that, during the meeting, both parties or both sides:

"acknowledged the importance of North South co-operation in accessing EU funds."

That is particularly important for research, innovation and development, for our businesses and for many of our stakeholders. Will the deputy First Minister provide us with information as to what is actually being done to deliver support and information downwards to the wider community, particularly to our small and medium-sized enterprises (SME) sector? Frankly, it is not happening at the moment in the way it should.

Martin McGuinness (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

I think the Member will be conscious of the fact that, for example, the First Minister and I, on one of our previous visits to Europe, met EU Commissioner Máire Geoghegan-Quinn. On foot of that conversation, Máire Geoghegan-Quinn came to Belfast and hosted a very important meeting, to which SMEs were invited. She clearly outlined her intention to try to simplify the process, which would allow SMEs to access European funds. As a result of that, I think there has been a 20% increase in the ability to access funds from Europe.

Obviously, the Member is right that more can be done, and I think that the process of continuing education for SMEs in relation to how they go about that is absolutely essential. That work is continuing, and in all of our discussions when we go to Brussels — we are not the only Ministers who go to Brussels — we are all very engaged. On almost every visit we have had to Brussels we have had the opportunity to meet Máire Geoghegan-Quinn. If the Member thinks that more can be done or has any ideas about how we can increase the level of drawdown from Europe, I would be very glad to meet him and have a discussion about that.

Leslie Cree (UUP, North Down)

I also thank the deputy First Minister for his statement. He referred to the negative impact of illegal fuel on the transport industry. Will he expand on that and advise the House on whether there are any new initiatives planned to bring people guilty of that criminal activity to justice?

Martin McGuinness (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

I think that we have seen, in recent months, a determined effort being made by the police services and the customs services, North and South, to target those criminals who are involved in illegal fuel laundering, particularly in border areas. I support that 100%. I think it is hugely important that that very damaging practice is brought to an end, not least because of the very destructive environmental difficulties that it presents for local communities, for animals and for society as a whole. So, I think that the evidence of an increased effort being made is now clearly there and that all of us should support that.

Jimmy Spratt (DUP, Belfast South)

I thank the deputy First Minister for his statement. I note that the Minister referred to the Ulster canal and the planning applications with Cavan County Council, Clones Town Council and Fermanagh District Council. Was there any discussion in relation to the entire scheme and the considerable good work that has been done by Belfast City Council, Castlereagh Borough Council and Lisburn City Council in relation to that project, which could be a very exciting tourism opportunity for Northern Ireland?

Martin McGuinness (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

I absolutely agree with the Member. It is a vital project, not least for our tourism. All you have to do is look at the amount of tourism traffic from places such as Carrick-on-Shannon to Limerick to understand the importance of canals to the local community.

At the meeting, we noted that work continues to progress on the restoration of the Ulster canal, and all the necessary planning permissions to restore the section of the canal to Lough Erne have been received. This inland waterway is a vital part in the jigsaw of the long-term restoration of the all-Ireland inland waterway network as a sustainable leisure asset. It is envisaged that the development of the canal will help to stimulate regeneration and assist in tackling poverty and social exclusion, particularly in isolated rural communities, with opportunities for employment and community engagement around water-based leisure and tourist activities. An interagency group has been established to explore possible funding options to advance the project. The fact that Lisburn and Belfast councils have taken an interest is a clear indicator that people increasingly accept the enormous value that a fully developed canal scheme would provide to local communities, for all the reasons that I outlined. I absolutely agree with the Member.

Joe Byrne (Social Democratic and Labour Party, West Tyrone)

I welcome the deputy First Minister's statement. Paragraphs 17 and 18 are timely. I welcome the fact that terms of reference 2 and 3 of the St Andrews Agreement are to be examined in the review of the North/South bodies.

With the north-west gateway initiative, does the deputy First Minister support the move to try to have a cross-border development at Lifford Bridge, called the riverine project, within the overall three rivers project?

Martin McGuinness (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

I am aware that that issue has been the subject of much recent discussion. Indeed, some of my colleagues, not least Pat Doherty, the MP for the area, have been proactive. Obviously, there is SEUPB involvement in the scheme. Given that other matters are under examination, there is an expectation in the Strabane area that if such projects experience difficulties and do not come to fruition, the SEUPB would look favourably at the riverine project. It is undoubtedly an important project for the Donegal/Tyrone area. We await the outcome of other deliberations to find out whether this project can be pursued in the immediate future.

Ian McCrea (DUP, Mid Ulster)

The deputy First Minister referred to progress being made on the mutual recognition of penalty points and that it was hoped that the necessary primary and secondary legislation would be in place by December 2014. Will the deputy First Minister assure the House that that is a realistic target, that there will be no slippage and that if there is any possibility of the date being brought forward, that will happen?

Martin McGuinness (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

The target would not be in the statement if we did not think that it was realistic. It is important that we recognise that we need consistency in how we deal with those issues. Progress continues to be made on the mutual recognition of penalty points across the island. There is no doubt that that will contribute significantly to making our roads much safer. It will complement and strengthen the benefits already achieved through the introduction of the mutual recognition of driving disqualifications in 2010. I agree with the Member that it is important to keep to the timeline, and I fully expect that that will be the case.

Seán Rogers (Social Democratic and Labour Party, South Down)

Thanks to the deputy First Minister for his statement and his answers so far. I draw his attention to the discussion on the Narrow Water bridge. There was quite a bit of discussion at Question Time yesterday, when the Finance Minister said that he was committed to giving £12 million and no more to the project. Will the deputy First Minister detail what he and the Executive are doing to ensure that that important economic project becomes a reality?

Martin McGuinness (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

At the meeting, we discussed the current situation of the Narrow Water bridge project. Unfortunately, since that meeting, it transpired that the project promoters, Louth County Council and the East Border Region, were unable to proceed with the project because of increased costs following formal tendering for the project. However, the East Border Region subsequently accepted the INTERREG IVa funding offer of €15 million on 20 August 2013. The project partners are working to secure the shortfall and have identified a number of potential funding streams. SEUPB is working closely with the project to ensure that firm proposals are brought forward for scrutiny as soon as possible. Just recently, when I met the Taoiseach in County Down at the funeral of Mary McAleese's father, I raised the issue with him. As a result of that conversation, I am encouraged that we might hear something positive from him about the matter in the not-too-distant future.

I am huge fan of bridge-building, not just in the political sense but in the context of how new structures can enhance the lives of people in different communities. All we have to do is look at the huge success of the Peace Bridge in my city. In just over two years, something like two million people have walked across it. So I have no doubt that the construction of this bridge would have a very positive effect on people in the communities that will benefit from it. I am hopeful that there will be a future resolution to the project. This morning, I read in the Hansard report what the Finance Minister said here yesterday, and I think that he, too, is looking to see what contribution will be made, not just by the Irish Government but by other interested parties.

John Dallat (Social Democratic and Labour Party, East Londonderry)

There was particular reference to unemployment among our young people. What cross-border initiatives are in place to tackle this serious problem that afflicts both North and South?

Martin McGuinness (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

In my answers earlier, I clearly indicated that a huge effort was being made to take advantage of whatever schemes can be put in place to deal with the issue. We look not least to funding that may come from Europe. Both North and South, we are proactively engaged in trying to ensure that some of that money comes in our direction. The fact that our Minister Farry has been invited by the Irish Government to participate in some of those discussions allows us and him, as the Minister responsible, to focus on what is a very serious problem in our community. So I expect positive initiatives to flow from that, and I think that we need to give them a little time, given that the European budget was only recently cleared.

Jim Allister (Traditional Unionist Voice, North Antrim)

I note, in the joint secretaries' progress report to the plenary, the reference to 214 projects under Peace III having received letters of offer. One such letter of offer related to the now abandoned Peace project at the Maze. Following the First Minister's welcome U-turn on that divisive proposal, what ideas does the Department have about where that £18 million might now be usefully spent?

Martin McGuinness (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

This issue has been the subject of considerable media and political interest in recent times. It is obvious that the question is being asked not just in the context of gaining information on whether that funding will be used and for what subject but in the context of trying to create more division. I am not prepared to play that game. We have to recognise that there is a serious problem and that the construction of the peace-building and conflict resolution centre was a commitment in the Programme for Government, and I will just leave it at that.

David McNarry (UKIP, Strangford)

I am still smiling at the deputy First Minister's reference to "tin whistle bands". I suppose what you do not know will not do you any harm. I will just leave it at that and ask my question.

The deputy First Minister referred to 250 people sharing knowledge on child protection. In light of the news that has hit and shocked the population of Northern Ireland, I ask him this: was the PSNI investigation, which was going on at the time of that conference, discussed at the meeting? Was the PSNI investigation itself made part of the shared knowledge that he refers to?

Martin McGuinness (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

I was not at the meeting, so I do not know. The information in relation to the PSNI investigation —

David McNarry (UKIP, Strangford)

Did you not ask?

Martin McGuinness (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

You asked about the PSNI investigation, and I am just about to address that.

It is an ongoing investigation. I heard a member of the PSNI give a very extensive interview on Stephen Nolan's radio programme this morning in relation to their handling of what is a very complex and difficult matter to deal with. I have not doubt whatsoever that they, in conjunction with the Department of Justice and the Department of Health, are very exercised about what you quite rightly identify as the shocking news that has reached us in recent days about the levels of child abuse and, specifically, the characters who are suspected of being involved.

What we need to do at this stage is use all our comments to encourage families and those people with information and knowledge to give that information to the Police Service so that those responsible can be brought before the courts. That has to be the big effort at this time. It is not about trying to undermine the PSNI or in any way question the approach that they have adopted to what is a very difficult matter given the complexities that surround such a scenario and the differences that might exist in the different cases that they are dealing with. That has to be the approach. All of us have to appeal to the community that if people have information, that information should be forwarded to the PSNI as a matter of urgency so that the people responsible for these heinous acts can be brought before the courts.

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle. With your permission, Mr Speaker, I wish to make a statement, in compliance with section 52 of the NI Act 1998, regarding the North/South Ministerial Council inland waterways meeting, which was held in Armagh on 19 June 2013. The Executive were represented by me, as Minister of Culture, Arts and Leisure, and junior Minister Jonathan Bell from the Office of the First Minister and deputy First Minister. The Irish Government were represented by Jimmy Deenihan TD, Minister for Arts Heritage and the Gaeltacht, and Dinny McGinley TD, Minister of State with responsibility for Gaeltacht affairs. This statement has been agreed with junior Minister Bell, and I make it on behalf of us both.

The Council received a progress report from Mr John Martin, chief executive of Waterways Ireland, on the work of Waterways Ireland, which includes the following significant achievements: the provision of 368 metres of additional moorings; the assessment of applications for the 2013 sponsorship programme, with the successful applicants informed and the programme commenced; the keeping open of 99·8% of waterways during the month of April; and the publication of 'A Taste of the Waterways 2013' and 'What’s On 2013'.

A presentation on Waterways Ireland's new website was made by Mr Éanna Rowe, head of marketing and communications. The presentation highlighted the benefits of the newly developed website, the first in Ireland to be hosted on a SharePoint platform, and how it can be used to promote the waterways as a major tourist attraction in its own right and as a valuable recreational and educational resource. The website enables users, individuals and businesses to do business online with the introduction of online forms and payments for services.

The Council approved the Waterways Ireland business plan for 2012 and recommended the budget provision of €31·15 million. It also noted progress on the development of the 2013 business plan and budget. Following approval by sponsor Departments and Finance Ministers, the plan will be brought forward for approval at a future NSMC meeting. The Council noted that the Waterways Ireland annual report and draft accounts for 2012 have been submitted to the Comptrollers and Auditors General and, following certification, they will be laid before the Assembly and both Houses of the Oireachtas.

The Council received a progress report on the restoration work for the Upper Lough Erne to Clones section of the Ulster canal. It was noted that Cavan County Council, Clones Town Council and Monaghan County Council have granted planning permission, and Fermanagh District Council has agreed the recommendation for approval. The project has now been approved by the Department of the Environment's Planning Service. Ministers noted that the interagency group on the Ulster canal, set up to explore funding options for advancing the Ulster canal project, held its second meeting on 16 May 2013, and sponsor Departments agreed to examine the potential social benefits and leveraged funding opportunities in that context.

The Council noted the assessment of options presented by sponsor Departments for a board for Waterways Ireland and the conclusions that the existing governance arrangements should be strengthened and that there is no requirement for the appointment of a board at this time. Ministers noted that sponsor Departments will bring forward an update on governance arrangements to a future NSMC meeting.

The Council consented to a number of property disposals, all of which were in the South of Ireland.

Ministers thanked John Martin for deferring his retirement to assist with the recruitment of his replacement and wished him well for the future. Ministers appointed Dawn Livingstone as chief executive of Waterways Ireland with effect from 29 July 2013.

The Council agreed to meet again in inland waterways sectoral format on 20 November 2013.

Michelle McIlveen (DUP, Strangford)

Can the Minister detail any discussions that she has had with the tourism Minister about the tourist potential of our waterways? Can she be more specific about the areas where the governance of Waterways Ireland needs to be strengthened? Why was it felt, at this stage, that there was no requirement for the appointment of a board?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I will try to answer the Member's three questions. I have had no discussions with the Minister of Enterprise, Trade and Investment, although I plan to. They will be brought forward after the next interagency meeting on the Ulster canal, because that is about tourism. I believe that the report that Éanna Rowe delivered to Waterways Ireland will be shared with other Departments.

There is no board at this time because Waterways Ireland was one of the bodies that did not need legislation to set up a board. However, I think it incumbent on all Ministers, particularly in the absence of a board, to look at governance arrangements, and where they can be improved, they should be. That does not indicate that there is any particular problem. Given the fact that we have to make reports to both Houses, we need to assure Members and, indeed, the public that we do this as a matter of course. It is not like a desktop exercise but a real one with constant updates, and I think it is to be welcomed.

Cathal Ó hOisín (Sinn Féin, East Londonderry)

Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle. Gabhaim buíochas leis an Aire as ucht a ráitis ar maidin. What is the position with the business plan and budgets for 2013? Will they go beyond the efficiency targets that were set out in previous agreements?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

The business plans are progressing well. I think that I have picked the Member up right. The concern has been expressed, particularly about waterways and languages, which we come to next, that, because of the financial situation, the Dublin Government have pressed for additional efficiency savings that have been agreed beyond that. I assure the Member that I am aware of the situation with my Irish counterparts. I have consistently said, and will continue to do so, that I am totally reluctant to go beyond what we agreed initially on funding for inland waterways and, indeed, the Irish language and Ulster Scots, and that remains the case.

Karen McKevitt (Social Democratic and Labour Party, South Down)

I acknowledge the fact that a lot of work has been done to help promote the waterways, with the publication of 'What's On 2013' and the newly developed Waterways Ireland website. What plans does the Minister's Department have to help promote and use that?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I assume, but I think it might be obvious, that the Committee for Culture, Arts and Leisure and the Committee for Enterprise, Trade and Investment would certainly get some value out of the presentation that we received from Mr Éanna Rowe. Apart from the fact that it is a first ever on this island, it reaches out to people, particularly small microbusinesses around the waterways, who very clearly feel that, in the past, they have not had opportunities to capitalise on tourism potential around waterways. We are looking particularly at how we, within Waterways Ireland, can bring that valuable tool forward and, more than that, try to share it with county councils and councils along the waterways, because if people do not know it is there and do not know how to access it and maximise the potential, it is a wasted opportunity. If the Committee does not have a copy of the report, I am happy to furnish it with a copy, and if the Committee wishes to have Éanna make a presentation, I am sure that the Committee will arrange that.

Anna Lo (Alliance, Belfast South)

I am very pleased to hear that the various local councils have given planning permission for the restoration work for the Upper Lough Erne to Clones section of the Ulster canal. Will the Minister outline what is mentioned in the progress report? What progress has been made so far?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

The progress report was primarily around the planning applications and outstanding concerns that the Environment Agency had about some of the wildlife and flora and fauna, particularly around Upper Lough Erne and Clones. Thankfully, they have been settled, and that is progress. As well as that, the interagency group, which has been set up to look at how funding for the Ulster canal can be maximised and developed, received a report on that. There has been a realisation that although the Irish Government made a commitment to fund the capital works, they are not in a position to fund it all at once, so we are starting to look at ways in which we could do it in stages. However, that is in the very, very early stages.

I think that progress in looking to see what options there are and taking a can-do attitude is progress worth noting. I am sure that the Member and other Members will be looking forward to future statements to see how the progress has been delivered and what it looks like.

William Irwin (DUP, Newry and Armagh)

The chief executive, Mr John Martin, reported on significant achievements. One of those achievements was that 99·8% of waterways remained open during the month of April. Has the Minister any figures to compare that with other months of the year?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I do not have them offhand, but I can certainly give them to the Member. If he looks back over previous statements that were made to the House, he will see that the percentages are very, very high. The waterways have been kept open. As far as I remember, the percentages are well in the nineties, but I am happy to get the Member precise figures.

Rosaleen McCorley (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle. Gabhaim buíochas leis an Aire as a ráiteas ar maidin agus as a freagraí go dtí seo. I thank the Minister for her statement this morning and for her answers up to now. Can the Minister outline the events sponsored by Waterways Ireland in 2013 and what benefits, if any, they may have for the local economy?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I thank the Member for her question. Waterways Ireland, with other bodies and agencies, has provided sponsorship for 105 events. They include the likes of Waterways Ireland Riverfest, water sports events on the lower Bann and the Lady of the Erne. The events are in County Fermanagh, in particular. The annual sponsorship is approximately £200,000, but I think the key to the question is what impact it might have on the local economy. It is estimated that, in 2012, 1·1 million people attended, accruing £85 million for the local economy. That excludes the Tall Ships.

There are many opportunities to be had from water-based tourism and, certainly, from holding events and festivals on the waterways. Not only does it lift people's mood and spirit but it adds to the local economy. For many people, particularly in rural areas, this is probably one of the very few, if only, opportunities that they have to do that.

David Hilditch (DUP, East Antrim)

With each statement, there usually come a number of property sales. What was the rationale behind those sales, and who benefits from them?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I have no figures relating to any such benefit. Property disposals are sometimes done through leases, so they are referred to as property disposals.

There were eight such disposals and, as I said in, all the properties were in the South of Ireland. Councils such as Longford County Council and Dublin City Council, which maintains the Royal canal towpath, are responsible for extending existing licences, which are referred to as property disposals.

When I first came across that term, it made me think of swathes of property being sold off, but that is not the case; it is just a term. The fact that local councils have been given the responsibility for the extension of leases shows not only that what was there previously worked but that there is confidence in the councils to deliver for the future.

Sean Lynch (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle. Gabhaim buíochas leis an Aire as a ráiteas. I thank the Minister for her statement. She may have gone some way to answering this question following Ms Lo's question, but were the section of the Ulster canal between Lough Erne and Clones to be started, how long would it take to complete?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I thank the Member for his question. To make progress on the restoration of the Ulster canal we need to look at an up-to-date business plan. I know that economists in DCAL have been involved in that. At one stage, hundreds of millions of pounds were cited as the cost of full completion through the different stages, so that has to costed.

There are options that we can look at. The Member will appreciate that, at this stage, I am reluctant to go into options because the business plan has not been completed. Part of that will involve looking at the options that we can afford, and, if they are done in stages, what they will cost. I am not too sure how long that will take, but I hope to have a report after the November sectoral meeting. A huge amount of work is involved, and the Member will appreciate that it is worth taking the time to get it right.

Dominic Bradley (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Newry and Armagh)

Go raibh míle maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle. Gabhaim buíochas leis an Aire as ucht a cuid freagraí. Ba mhaith liom ceist a chur ar an Aire: an nglacfadh sí le cuireadh ó Chumann Uiscebhealaí Intíre na hÉireann, craobh an Iúir agus Phort an Dúnáin teacht chuig Iúr Chinn Trá agus féacháint ar an deisiúchán a rinne an cumann ar chanáil an Iúir?

I thank the Minister for her answers. Will she accept an invitation to come to Newry to view the work that the Portadown and Newry branch of the Inland Waterways Association of Ireland has done on the Newry canal?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I thank the Member for his invite. I agreed to visit Newry canal at the request of the MP for the area, Conor Murphy. The request for the meeting came in during the summer, and I was conscious that the Member had extended the invitation previously. I wanted to wait until we were back here, and I am happy to go down. I hope to have that visit arranged for the middle or the end of October. I will keep in contact with the Member, and he will be made aware of all the details of that visit.

William Humphrey (DUP, Belfast North)

I thank the Minister for her statement to the House. I welcome the progress that has been made with Cavan County Council, Monaghan County Council and Fermanagh District Council on Upper Lough Erne. Will the Minister advise the House what progress is being made by Waterways Ireland across Northern Ireland, particularly on the Ulster canal, to show some benefit from the taxes put into that North/South body? Have approaches been made to Europe for funding?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I thank the Member for his questions. I will take the second question first. Yes, I met Pat Colgan from the SEUPB, not just to raise the issue of the Ulster canal but to attempt to get a better result for arts and sports from European funding. I have met many groups that have done fantastic work throughout the years but still have difficulty accessing European funds. I certainly discussed the Ulster canal and inland waterways with him.

I am totally satisfied that Waterways Ireland is not, in its work on waterways in the North, including the Ulster canal and other canals, fixated on one part of the country at the detriment of the other. To be frank, if I thought that that was the case, regardless of where you and I come from politically, I would not allow that to happen.

Trying to restore the Ulster canal is a big challenge — it is a huge challenge. As well as the interagency group that we have set up, Ministers are looking for other opportunities individually. On that basis, I met Pat Colgan. I will meet him again and, where possible, with others. That may include the Heritage Lottery Fund and others. We will see whether anything can be done to start looking at ways of beginning the restoration.

The restoration will, undoubtedly, bring huge opportunities for local employment and apprenticeships. The end result will be not just be the opening up of a waterway, which, in itself, is very important. It will also help with the promotion of tourism, angling and all the rest that goes with it, which will help the local economy.

Michael McGimpsey (UUP, Belfast South)

I begin by commending Waterways Ireland for the work that it has done under John Martin as chief executive. I trust that the new chief executive will carry on in that tradition.

As we discussed, the Ulster canal is a huge capital project, but just because it is a huge capital project does not mean that we will walk away from it in any way. The project target and dream of connecting Belfast and Dublin by inland waterways is of huge value, not least in terms of the tourist product. The way to do this is by doing small bits at a time — it would cost over £100 million to do it all at once.

On public perception, you have sections between Belfast and Lisburn and Lisburn and Lough Neagh. Would that not be another way of exciting the public imagination?

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

I encourage the Member to come to his question.

Michael McGimpsey (UUP, Belfast South)

Thank you, Mr Speaker. I have waited a long time, so I thought that I should get my money's worth.

That would be an important way forward. What progress has been made on the stretches from Belfast to Lisburn and Lisburn to Lough Neagh?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I thank the Member for his statement. There has been some progress.

The Member is right, and I accept his sentiments about John Martin. I am sure that John Martin will read Hansard and be grateful for those sentiments. He has done excellent work. As I said in the statement, John stayed on until we had gone through the recruitment process for the new chief executive, which is a big ask when someone has plans and a lot of demanding daughters. I am sure that John will be delighted to read those comments.

The Member is correct: the work to take the Ulster canal from the Lagan to Lisburn, on to Lough Neagh and then opening it up further will cost hundreds of millions of pounds. We need to start to look at what the different stages and phases will cost. Belfast City Council has done excellent work on the Lagan canal, but a huge amount of money is needed.

I have asked for a recent update because, sometimes, business cases have figures that were OK seven or eight years ago, but there is a different market now — the figures may go up, but the market is more competitive. We need to look at all that and make decisions about what we can do and when we do it. I am certainly not taking the approach that we do not have the money to do it all at once. I am looking at what we have and what we can do. I will then get agreement on that and move ahead.

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle. Thank you, Mr Speaker. With your permission and in compliance with section 52 of the NI Act 1998, I wish to make a statement on the North/South Ministerial Council (NSMC) Language Body meetings that were held in Armagh on 19 June and 10 July 2013.

The Executive were represented by me, as Minister of Culture, Arts and Leisure, and junior Minister Jonathan Bell from the Office of the First Minister and deputy First Minister. The Irish Government were represented by lead Minister Dinny McGinley TD, Minister of State with special responsibility for Gaeltacht affairs, and Jimmy Deenihan TD, Minister for Arts, Heritage and the Gaeltacht. The statement has been agreed with junior Minister Bell, and I make it on behalf of us both.

The meeting on 19 June dealt with issues relating to the language body and its two constituent agencies. Foras na Gaeilge's review of core funding was discussed, and it was agreed that a further meeting of the NSMC Language Body would be held as soon as possible, but not later than September, in order to bring the process to a conclusion.

The Council noted progress reports from the chairpersons and the chief executive officers of both agencies, which included the following achievements: with regard to the Ulster-Scots Agency, the provision of support in the education system, including 16 after-school clubs in the primary sector and two educational fairs in the post-primary sector in addition to advancement of the Ulster-Scots flagship programme for primary schools; the promotion of Ulster-Scots culture through delivery of three talks at the agency's interpretative centre and seven seminars to raise awareness of agency-funded programmes for festivals and summer schools, in addition to support for a heritage event for over 400 people at the Presbyterian General Assembly held in Derry for the first time; the provision of community support, including funding for six Ulster-Scots community showcase events and funding for 195 groups for music and dance tuition; and sponsorship of a plaque for James Bryce, a prominent Ulster Scot of Edwardian times, which was unveiled in May 2013 on the 175th anniversary of his birth as part of the partnership programme with the Ulster History Circle.

With regard to Foras na Gaeilge, an evaluation of the summer camps scheme has been completed and funding was to be provided for in excess of 50 camps catering for over 2,000 young people during July and August 2013; the Irish language officers scheme in the North, which aims to improve the status of the Irish language at local level and build on Líofa 2015 by providing the public with a range of bilingual services, has been advertised for the period July 2013 to March 2016; a promotional campaign is under way throughout the public sector, North and South, in regard to the helpline Freagra, which provides an Irish language translation service to the public sector; and a conference on minority languages in the arts, Voces in Artes, was organised in May 2013 as part of Ireland's EU presidency.

The Council also noted the ongoing collaboration between the Ulster-Scots Agency and Foras na Gaeilge in regard to governance issues and promotion of the work of the language body, including the establishment of a committee to oversee a joint work programme, the current consultation process on the joint equality scheme, and funding for 'The Honest Sod', a play in Ulster Scots and Irish, which has toured to 88 schools and has been seen by over 3,000 pupils.

Ministers noted that the sponsor Departments are working with both agencies to finalise the 2013 business plans and budgets and, following approval by Finance Ministers, will bring them forward for approval as soon as possible to a future NSMC language meeting.

The Council noted that the 2010 consolidated language body annual report and accounts were certified by the Comptrollers and Auditors General on 10 June 2013 and were to be laid in the Houses of the Oireachtas and the Assembly in July 2013. Ministers further noted that it is envisaged by the Comptrollers and Auditors General that the 2011 language body annual report and accounts will be certified in autumn 2013, and that field audits will commence in September 2013 in regard to the 2012 annual report and accounts. The Council also acknowledged the ongoing cooperation with the independent offices of the Comptrollers and Auditors General in both jurisdictions, as a result of which 10 sets of annual reports and accounts for the language body have been published in the period 2005-2012.

Ministers noted the work being undertaken by the Ulster-Scots Agency to progress the Discover Ulster Scots initiative. This will create a coherent branding capable of being applied to tourist products and experiences that are relevant to Ulster-Scots heritage and a single web-based access point where visitors will be able to find out about places to go and things to do that reflect Ulster-Scots heritage.

An NSMC language meeting to further discuss Foras na Gaeilge core funding proposals was arranged for 10 July 2013. At that meeting, Ministers approved new funding arrangements to replace the existing core funding model, comprising the following key elements. The delivery by six lead organisations, operating on an all-island basis, of the following strategic priorities: Irish-medium education; Irish language in English-medium education; language-centred community and economic development; language use; language planning; and youth networks. The establishment by Foras na Gaeilge of an all-island partnership forum to ensure a collaborative approach by the six lead organisations; the establishment by Foras na Gaeilge of an all-island language development forum that is representative of local language interests funded by Foras na Gaeilge at community level; the development of a community radio scheme to provide funding for Irish language community radio in both jurisdictions; and future funding to be provided for An tÁisaonad, as appropriate, in the context of Foras na Gaeilge's statutory function in regard to supporting Irish-medium education and the teaching of Irish.

The Council also directed Foras na Gaeilge to proceed with the implementation of the new funding arrangements with effect from 1 July 2014, subject to approval by Finance Departments, and agreed to extend the core funding arrangements to 30 June 2014, when the new funding arrangements will take effect.

The Council agreed that its next language body meeting will take place on 20 November 2013.

Michelle McIlveen (DUP, Strangford)

I understand that the 2012 business plans and budget for the Ulster-Scots Agency and Foras na Gaeilge were not approved until March 2013. Furthermore, we are now in September, with no approval for the business plan and budget for this year. When does the Minister expect those to be signed off? I also note that the language bodies are coming to the end of their current corporate plan. When does she anticipate those new plans being approved?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I anticipate those new plans being approved as soon as possible. I imagine that, if they are not, we can confirm that they will be done at the next meeting, which is on 20 November. As the Member is aware, there has been a considerable backlog over the years of not just the reports and accounts but the business plans. I am content with the work being done by senior officials from both jurisdictions with both agencies to ensure not only that they are brought up to date but that we are made aware of difficulties and issues well in advance and that remedial work to bring those up to where they need to be is done as early as possible rather than being left to the last minute — I am not saying that that is the case, but that sometimes appears to be the perception. I am happy that the work is in a much better place than where it was but we still have a bit more to do.

Cathal Ó hOisín (Sinn Féin, East Londonderry)

Go raibh maith agat a Cheann Comhairle. Gabhaim buíochas leis an Aire as ucht an dara ráiteas a thug sí dúinn ar maidin. I know that this issue has been brought up previously, but can the Minister tell the House what specifically is causing the delay in publishing the North/South Language Body annual reports and accounts?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

The delays go back to 2000-01 when the chair of the Ulster-Scots Agency refused to sign off. That caused a knock-on delay throughout the years. In fact, because all the accounts are done in chronological order, we are always trying to catch up. In that respect, the chairs and chief executives of both language bodies find themselves in the unenviable position of always working on the back foot. However, we are hoping, as I said to the Chair of the Committee, that the business plans will be brought forward and approved at the next meeting, which is on 20 November.

Just to repeat — it was mentioned during the previous statement — I am very conscious of the situation that Ministers Deenihan and McGinley are in with their budgets, but I have been and still am totally reluctant to go beyond what we agreed the efficiency savings should be.

Karen McKevitt (Social Democratic and Labour Party, South Down)

Does the Minister agree that it would be more appropriate for the Department of Education to fund the Áisaonad at St Mary's University College? Will she pursue that issue with the Minister of Education?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

That issue has been raised previously. There have been discussions with Ministers on who should fund not so much An tÁisaonad but, certainly, different aspects. The decision has been made. I welcome the Member's concern that funding for what would seem to be a purely educational matter is coming out of the Department of Culture, Arts and Leisure (DCAL) budget, which, as the Member has always said, is the smallest Executive budget. However, until discussions have been progressed and it is agreed by both education Departments, it is a matter for the language body to bring forward future funding for An tÁisaonad. I also think that it is incumbent on An tÁisaonad and, indeed, St Mary's to look for whatever shortfalls of funding they have from other bodies and agencies as well. There seems to be a pattern of just asking and expecting DCAL to fund the shortfall. The work that they do is very important, but they need to look at long-term funding support for that work.

Michael McGimpsey (UUP, Belfast South)

I note that Foras na Gaeilge, under its Irish language officers' scheme, is advertising for the period from 2013 to 2016. That is within the new remit of this Assembly; however, it is outside the remit of the Budget. As I understand it, the Budget still stops at 2015. Can the Minister remind us how many officers we are talking about and at what annual cost?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I do not have the figures for the number of officers who have been recruited through that latest round of funding. I will certainly write to the Member. I am happy to provide him with that and also to clarify the position with regard to what happens between 2015 and 2016, which is outside of this mandate.

Anna Lo (Alliance, Belfast South)

I welcome the many different programmes that are provided by the Ulster-Scots Agency. How is the effectiveness of those activities monitored and evaluated?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I think that the Member was in the House when the deputy First Minister made his statement and referred to 'The Honest Sod', which is a play in Ulster Scots and the Irish language that has been seen by 3,000 pupils from 88 schools. The feedback and evaluation was that it was very worthwhile and raised awareness and mutual respect for diversity. That is one obvious example of monitoring and evaluation. It is important that we look at the work of both agencies, not only what they do separately but what they do together. Certainly, in building a shared and better future, work that we can do across language and cultural heritage is good for everybody. You do not need to go through a whole pile of questions on an evaluation form to know that it is good, it works and that more people from other Departments and bodies should do more of the same.

David Hilditch (DUP, East Antrim)

I thank the Minister for her statement. In the emerging strategy, is there any aspiration on the part of the Minister to seek a greater degree of parity between the two parts or sides of the language body? For instance, £2·7 million is spent on Ulster Scots compared with £15 million that is spent on Foras na Gaeilge, plus other money. Given the year-on-year reductions, it is believed that reductions are felt more strongly in the Ulster-Scots community.

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I do not believe that has been the case with regard to reductions and the Ulster-Scots community. The Member is aware that money has gone through the ministerial advisory group for the academy. Money has been spent there. Those budgets were based on the need at the time. They have been and will be reviewed constantly. It is about delivering to the point of need, which is about equality, rather than parity. It is not, "If you get fifty, I get fifty, just because." That is not a good use of public money. I am not suggesting that the Member is saying that. However, I am conscious of that issue.

I am actually happier this year than I was, perhaps, a year or so ago about work, particularly by the Ulster-Scots Agency, and the efforts that it has made to try to bring cohesion between all the networks and groups in the Ulster-Scots community, first of all, to ensure that money is spent well and that there is an outcome, rather than just a process, and, more than that, to make the case constantly and provide evidence for future funding. In my view, that is what was missing previously. Therefore, with regard to parity, I am glad to see greater sharing of better practice between the Ulster-Scots Agency and Foras na Gaeilge, which will help the agency in future. Parity for the sake of it in funding is something that we should not, and never will, do simply for the sake of spending public money.

Rosaleen McCorley (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle. Gabhaim buíochas leis an Aire as a ráiteas agus as a freagraí go dtí seo. I thank the Minister for her statement and her answers so far. What are the new all-Ireland structures that Foras na Gaeilge is proposing as part of the new arrangements?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I thank the Member for her question. Two particular structures are new. One is an all-Ireland partnership forum, which is really about ensuring a collaborative approach, particularly on the six themes that I outlined, by the six leading organisations, albeit that there is collaboration among all the groups that exist at the minute. That is really important for sharing, better networking and to ensure a better product not only for people who use or learn the Irish language but for future language development. I am sure that the Member will agree that that is a welcome step.

The second structure is an all-Ireland language development forum, which is crucial because it will look at how, across this island, we develop the language and make sure that it is being taught. The standards and materials that we use to teach the language are very important, but we are also trying to look at parts of the island where there are no services at all for the Irish language and to see, through that forum, how that need can be met.

Those are examples of two new forums that have been developed as a result of the work of the NSMC. I, like everyone else, look forward to seeing how they will roll out, but I know that there has been a gap and that a lot of people in the sector from one end of the island to the other have welcomed this initiative.

William Humphrey (DUP, Belfast North)

While I am on my feet, I want to take the opportunity on behalf of my party to once again congratulate the Field Marshal Montgomery Pipe Band on becoming grade-one world champions in Glasgow.

Minister, I have spoken to members of the Ulster-Scots Agency board over the past few days. The Minister indicated in her answer to my colleague the Chairperson of the Committee that she intends to cut budgets. Those cuts will have a devastating blow for the Ulster-Scots Agency, given that it gets its funding only from the Department here in Northern Ireland. There is a huge disparity in funding. Foras na Gaeilge received €15 million, compared with funding of £2·7 million from our Government for the Ulster-Scots Agency. Those cuts will be devastating. Will the Minister explain why there is such a huge disparity in funding between the two bodies? Will the Minister not work, as my colleague from East Antrim has urged, for parity in funding to deliver equality here in Northern Ireland?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

The Member is factually incorrect. I did not say to anyone that I was agreeing to cuts. In fact, I said in my previous sectoral statement, and repeated to Cahal Ó hOisín and others, that I do not want to go beyond what has been agreed in efficiency savings.

William Humphrey (DUP, Belfast North)

You did not say that you had agreed.

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I did say that I agreed. You can check the Hansard report, and then you can come back and apologise. I did say that. [Interruption.]

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

Order.

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I will ensure that I will not go beyond what was agreed. As for parity, is the Member actually suggesting — I think that this needs to be nailed — that I provide additional money when need has not been demonstrated and given that moneys were returned in the past because they could not be spent, even on identified need? If the Member is seriously suggesting that we provide moneys solely for the sake of parity, I will end up in front of the Member behind me at the Public Accounts Committee if that funding could have been spent on something else. Do I want to make sure that Ulster Scots gets the money that it deserves? Absolutely. I think that things are going in the right direction. I think, with the consolidation of services in a network and, hopefully, through the academy, there will be a better return for the Ulster-Scots community. However, arguing for parity just for its own sake is politically naive and wrong.

Dominic Bradley (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Newry and Armagh)

Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle. Táimid thar a bheith gnóthach anseo inniu ag cur ceisteanna agus ag díospóireacht. Gabhaim buíochas leis an Aire as ucht an méid a dúirt sí go dtí seo. Ó thaobh na samhla nua maoinithe de, an aontaíonn an tAire leis na daoine sin a chreideann go ndéanfaidh an tsamhail nua maoinithe damáiste as cuimse d’eagraíochtaí Gaeilge agus d’infreastruchtúr na Gaeilge anseo sa Tuaisceart?

It is a busy day for culture, arts and leisure. I thank the Minister for her answers. Does she agree with those who say that the new core funding model that is proposed by Foras na Gaeilge will lead to the demise of several important Irish language organisations in the North and will damage the infrastructure of the language here?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

Ní aontaím go hiomlán leat. I do not agree with that sentiment at all. In fact, I think that the new core funding arrangements should enhance, develop and protect the long-term development of the language. I am sure that the Member and others who have raised this before, as, indeed, he has, will agree with me that it is vital that we look at the needs of the sector and, in doing that, at who will deliver the services. I often talk to groups that say that not funding their work will result in the demise of the whole sector. I question that and then look for the evidence, but it is not there.

I want to make sure that groups that currently receive funding through Foras na Gaeilge have opportunities to become one of those lead groups. There is absolutely nothing to say that that cannot happen, but what will not happen on my watch is the continued funding of salaries and very little money going into the development of the language on the ground. Language officers are being well developed and well looked after, but language recipients need to have a bit more support, and the core funding arrangements provide just that. We need to build on that and look at the work of other Departments to ensure the long-term development of the language, not the long-term development and security of some language development officers.

Committee Business

William Hay (Speaker, Foyle)

The Business Committee has agreed to allow up to one hour and 30 minutes for the debate. The proposer of the motion will have 10 minutes to propose and 10 minutes to make a winding-up speech. All other Members who wish to speak will have five minutes.

Michelle McIlveen (DUP, Strangford)

I beg to move

That this Assembly recognises the economic, cultural, social and educational benefits that a regional library for Northern Ireland would provide; and urges the Minister of Culture, Arts and Leisure to engage with Executive colleagues and other partners to pursue Belfast central library’s redevelopment plan to create a regional library as part of the overall Library Square project.

Today’s motion is not the first time that library provision has been debated in the Assembly. Libraries have been and will remain a key area of focus for the Committee. That is unsurprising given that libraries are the focal point of a community. They offer a shared community space, help to stimulate learning and contribute to social cohesion. Increasingly, they offer a multipurpose space where a wide range of community activities can take place. The Committee saw an excellent example of that kind of facility when it held a meeting at the library in Lisburn. While the Committee met in one room, all sorts of other activities were happening throughout the building, including mother and toddler groups, people using the internet, classes and, of course, people coming to borrow books.

Today’s motion is about recognising the economic, social and educational benefits that a regional library for Northern Ireland could provide. The Committee, at its meeting at Belfast central library, heard from officials about how a redeveloped Belfast central library would provide a fit-for-purpose setting to display its many resources, collections and artefacts, giving it the status of a regional library and providing a fitting flagship building for the Library Square redevelopment. Anyone who has visited that library could not fail to be saddened by the limitations placed on service provision by a building that has long since ceased to be fit for purpose.

When Belfast central library opened in 1888 — indeed, it is its 125th anniversary this year— it was considered to be leading the way in city libraries. The building is beautiful, with a host of late Victorian features and characteristics. However, this architectural gem is now blighted by the ravages of time and the addition of ugly extensions to the rear. It is no longer at the cutting edge of library provision.

The Committee was fortunate, during its recent study visit to Liverpool, to have a tour of the redeveloped central library on the day that it was due to open to the public. Following a £50 million renovation, that library now has space to show its collections, provide learning environments and lecture theatres, display its rare books and do all the other things that a modern library does. It is an extraordinary building that makes a clear statement about Liverpool’s pride in itself and the facilities that it wants to provide for its people.

Members will have seen in the media the recent unveiling of Birmingham’s redeveloped central library. Some £200 million was spent on providing the largest library in Europe. The Liverpool and Birmingham libraries that I have mentioned are part of wider city regeneration projects, and I suggest that nothing illustrates a people-centred regeneration of a city more than putting a modern, fit-for-purpose library at its heart.

If Members are not convinced by the examples of Liverpool and Birmingham, I also point to Dublin's plans for its central library. The Committee is aware of Dublin's plans for a cultural quarter at Parnell Square, which will involve the development of a new and innovative Dublin city library. Edinburgh has similar plans.

The investment strategy for Northern Ireland recognises the benefits of Belfast central library as a regional library for Northern Ireland, with a commitment to consider investment during 2016-2021. However, the time is right now to invest in the redevelopment of Belfast central library. Indeed, it is an essential development to facilitate a number of Programme for Government priorities and other related strategies. Currently, the Belfast central library receives approximately 400,000 visits a year and provides a highly valued service for not only the local community but Belfast and the wider population of Northern Ireland. The Belfast Streets Ahead project, with a proposed new University of Ulster campus at York Street, together with the granting of planning permission for the Royal Exchange development, has provided a unique opportunity for the regeneration of Belfast central library. Therefore, it seems inconceivable that that library should remain in its current form without significant investment while the surrounding area is transformed into a communications and learning hub.

Libraries NI’s proposal is to develop a purpose-designed world-class centre for knowledge, information, culture and heritage that will contribute to all aspects of the Programme for Government. It will benefit all the people of Northern Ireland as a regional hub, and it is hoped that it will become a destination for people from outside Northern Ireland and will complement other cultural facilities in the city. A regional library would bring economic benefits to the region. There is the potential to support the creative industries through the extensive collection of resources, including the historical and fine books that are often a source of inspiration to people working in the sector. The library houses the most extensive collection of freely available business resources in Northern Ireland, including market research, company and financial data, British Standards, copyrights, trademarks and patents, and provides information and support for students, those involved in business start-up and established businesses.

Members will be aware of the Library Square development, linked to the Department for Social Development’s north-west quarter regeneration framework, which sees the redevelopment of Belfast central library as a catalyst for the regeneration of that part of Belfast. Of course, the added benefit of the redevelopment of the library is the resulting construction jobs and many skilled apprenticeships.

I also want to outline a number of important social benefits that would flow from the library’s redevelopment. The library is already recognised as a shared space, and redevelopment provides an opportunity to contribute significantly to the Together: Building a United Community strategy, which outlines a vision for a united community based on equality of opportunity and the desirability of good relations and reconciliation, where cultural expression is celebrated and embraced and where everyone can live, learn, work and socialise together. The library has a significant collection of unique materials relating to our cultural heritage, both local and national. The people of Belfast and, indeed, Northern Ireland deserve a special place where they can explore all the things that unite us culturally and that illustrate and celebrate our differences. It is important for our communities that there is a shared space where they can explore each other’s cultural identity and come together to experience a shared identity.

The project provides a number of other educational benefits, including learning programmes using new technologies that the current building cannot support. Redevelopment of the library would also allow work to support people who are unemployed by helping them to gain the skills necessary to improve their employability. Important work with children could also be undertaken, particularly on the development of a love of reading.

Currently, Northern Ireland has no legal deposit library. That means that there is no library where there is a legal requirement for works published by Ulster authors to be held. Such a facility would allow current, past and future works to be held, and that would allow 18th- and 19th-century works, including those recording the famine, to be held in one place. An added bonus would be that the library would become a hub for the Ulster diaspora, where they could go to find out more about culture and literary heritage. Furthermore, it could help to create and consolidate international links with countries where those who have left these shores and contribute to our literary legacy are now settled. Belfast central library would be the perfect location for such a collection.

The Committee is aware that Libraries NI will submit a business case to DCAL at the end of October seeking financial support for its vision of a regional library for Northern Ireland. The Committee urges the Minister of Culture, Arts and Leisure to engage with Executive colleagues and other partners to pursue Belfast central library’s redevelopment plan as part of the overall Library Square project, and to look favourably on Libraries NI’s business case for the redevelopment of Belfast central library and all the benefits that would accrue from it.

I ask Members to support the vision of something better for our people. Surely they deserve the same sort of facilities that the people of Liverpool and Birmingham can now enjoy and that the people of Edinburgh and Dublin are looking forward to. A regional library in Belfast would make a clear statement that we see information, communication and education as key to the improvement of our community's situation and that we are proud of and wish to display the products of our rich cultural heritage, both shared and separate.

I thank all Members who will contribute to today’s debate and encourage them to support the motion. I commend the motion to the House.

Cathal Ó hOisín (Sinn Féin, East Londonderry)

Beidh mé ag labhairt inniu i bhfabhar an mholta seo. I support the motion and am glad that it has come before the House. The Committee for Culture, Arts and Leisure visited the central library for a meeting in June and, indeed, the Chair of the Committee and me had a more extensive visit previously. I was quite shocked by the condition of the library, particularly that of the two newer buildings that were built in the 1960s and the 1980s. I was shocked by the conditions in which some of the great resources that are contained within central library are stored. To describe the two buildings that were added on as carbuncles might be an appropriate analogy because they certainly do not sit well with the original 19th-century building, which outlived its use a long time ago. I believe that those buildings have also outlived their usage.

In a previous life, I was a researcher and spent much of my time in dusty vaults looking up records. It always surprises me how they survive down through the years as they have, given the conditions in which they were held through damp, fire, floods, the Troubles, and all the rest of it. We have a unique collection of materials in Belfast central library. We have one of the greatest fine book collections, but access to that is limited to the general public because of the conditions in the library. The FJ Bigger collection is hugely culturally important, and the patents collection is the only one of its kind in Ireland and traces much of the industrial heritage and development in this part of Ireland.

We have a unique opportunity here in the development of the Library Quarter. We have to look at the way other quarters developed, including the Gaeltacht Quarter, based around An Chultúrlann; Cathedral Quarter around St Anne's and Writer's Square; and indeed the Titanic Quarter and the iconic building there. I believe that this is an opportunity to bring regeneration to a very neglected part of the city but also to serve the wider region. This is a wonderful opportunity to advance that.

The current library is probably less than a quarter of the size of what would be required, and that is something we should look at. The proposals that have been brought forward include resources such as a business library, as the Chair mentioned, as well as a dedicated children's library, community meeting spaces, learning centres and a totally inclusive centre of culture. The old adage of "build it and they will come" can apply to libraries, and I have seen that in my constituency and in my own town where the new library was opened two and a half years ago and where the attendance and borrowing figures mushroomed. The figure of 400,000 people currently using Belfast central library could be increased. Indeed, the very low number of loans at the moment could be increased. There is also a chance to increase the wider value to the public realm. The Chair touched on the proximity of the York Street campus, but it will be part of the general improvement and regeneration of that entire area. It is a wonderful opportunity to go for that and deliver a project here that, in real terms — we compared it with Dublin, Birmingham and other places — is a really good investment for the future.

The current library, which was built in 1888, has served the people of Belfast and the wider region very well. Let us hope that we have the vision now to establish a building that will see us through the next 125 years to the 250th anniversary. I support the motion.

Karen McKevitt (Social Democratic and Labour Party, South Down)

I support the motion. I am pleased to add my comments to it, as protecting and enhancing our library services is one of my top priorities. I begin by commending the work of the Committee Clerk, Mr Peter Hall, and all the staff in preparation for today's debate. It is greatly appreciated by all the Committee members.

I am delighted that we are discussing the potential creation of a regional library. You may remember that in 2011 and 2012 in this Chamber, we united together and resisted a proposal to greatly reduce the opening hours of libraries. By doing so, we protected the valuable services they provide. I hope that today we can unite together to support Belfast central library's redevelopment plan to create a regional library as part of the overall Library Square project.

Libraries provide the public with a space for learning, socialising and engaging. Their purpose has been re-imagined to meet modern needs. They are no longer for only quiet reading and borrowing of books; today's libraries are centres of learning that offer many services to the community. An article in the 'The Guardian' by Ken Worpole tells us that the so-called glamming up of libraries is a worldwide trend in response to a revived global enthusiasm for libraries. That enthusiasm certainly seems to be present in Birmingham, as 10,300 visitors came to the opening of the new library on the first day. It is thought that that popular libraries culture has come about as more and more people are engaging in higher forms of education and need study space and access to internet facilities. Libraries are also transforming themselves as community hubs, where people gather to meet friends, view art pieces in a gallery space, listen to storytelling sessions, meet authors or join book clubs. Dare I say that there is a new generation of people who today consider libraries as a cool place to be.

In the digital era, where people communicate through Facebook, Twitter, e-mail, WhatsApp and Snapchat, to name but a few of the modern apps, providing a space for social engagement has never been so important. To combine social engagement with learning opportunities is just icing on the cake. Here in Northern Ireland, we have another reason to value knowledge and educational sources that can be gained and accessed through public libraries. Access to educational resources to develop knowledge on a particular topic gives the public an opportunity to fight any cause that they may have through the words of democratic means rather than violence. Sixteen-year-old Taliban victim Malala Yousafzai opened Birmingham's new and vibrant library with a strong message: pens and books are the greatest weapon against terrorism.

As a champion for libraries, I felt that it was important to spend some time during the summer recess visiting libraries in my constituency of South Down along with Libraries NI chief executive, Irene Knox, to see at first hand the wonderful services that they provide to the community. I am looking forward to the opening of the new modernised library in Kilkeel, which will be open to the public in early 2014. I also visited libraries in Omagh and Fintona with my SDLP colleague Joe Byrne. I found both libraries to be excellent, but Omagh library was a very special experience indeed, as I had the opportunity to view resources that tell the story of the Omagh bomb and remember the victims who lost their lives on that tragic day. I encourage anyone who has not been to make time to visit Omagh library to view its wonderful archive.

I agree with the Committee that a regional library in Belfast would complement the services provided by other libraries across the region.

That is why I urge the Minister to engage with her Executive colleagues and ensure that Belfast central library's redevelopment plan for a regional library is considered and developed.

Michael McGimpsey (UUP, Belfast South)

I have absolutely no problem with the motion as far as the redevelopment of Belfast central library is concerned. It fits in very well with the proposed development at Library Square and the University of Ulster development. Major moneys are to be invested in the area, together with the Royal Exchange and on the back of the Metropolitan Arts Centre. A business case has been produced. The current building is long past its time for development. It is not fit for purpose, and it gives us an opportunity for a modern, state-of-the-art library for Belfast that is fitting for the image of our city and merges the old with the new as far as library services are concerned, bringing in things such as a children's library, a business library, a creative lab facility, increased IT and a community meeting space. There will also be a cafe and retail outlets, which will bring together what we understand to be a modern central regional library such as we have seen in other parts of the UK and in proposals for Dublin. I commend all of that as an important step.

We talk about:

"A flexible and responsive library service which provides a dynamic focal point in the community and assists people to fulfil their potential".

That is the strapline, as I understand it, for Libraries NI, the body that oversees our libraries. This, however, to my mind, sits in stark contrast to what happened three years ago in Belfast, when eight libraries were shut. Those libraries were in exactly those communities that needed them most. Carnegie talked about libraries being:

"instruments for the elevation of the masses of the people".

They were seen as providing access to learning and advancement for people who had limited opportunities for education and self-improvement. Those libraries were in places among communities that had limited opportunities for education and self-improvement, including Sandy Row, Oldpark, Andersonstown and the Braniel. That is what happened in Belfast. There was another proposal to close a further nine libraries outside Belfast, and I have commended the Minister for her actions at that point, because she stepped in and stopped those libraries being closed. That was important, and it was the right thing to do.

If we are looking forward to library provision, it cannot simply be about a grand regional library in Royal Avenue, Belfast, much as we need that, at a cost of over £30 million. I believe that the Department and the Minister need to direct the attention of Libraries NI back to those communities that have lost out. Communities think that libraries are important, but they do not go to them very often. They do not necessarily use them, so the issue is access. You cannot compare a library in a community such as Sandy Row or Andersonstown that is open six or seven days a week with a van that parks on waste ground for a few hours one day a week. You do not get the sort of use that you require.

I have no problem with the proposal, but there is now an opportunity for the Minister to intervene again with the Department and the libraries service to look again at the communities that have lost out and have had their library services taken away from them. It gives us an opportunity, therefore, to re-engage with those communities to give them access again to learning and advancement. Those people have limited opportunities for education and self-improvement. The libraries service was designed to provide that for those communities, and here is an opportunity for us.

The debate stood suspended.

The sitting was suspended at 12.29 pm.

On resuming (Mr Principal Deputy Speaker [Mr Mitchel McLaughlin] in the Chair) —

Oral Answers to Questions

Mitchel McLaughlin (Sinn Féin, South Antrim)

We will begin with topical questions, which will last for up to 15 minutes, and we will then move on to deal with those that appear on the list of questions for oral answer.

Tom Buchanan (DUP, West Tyrone)

1. asked the Minister for Employment and Learning what strategy he has in place and what work he is doing with the University of Ulster given its drop in the past six years from 54 to 88 in the ‘Guardian’ league table. (AQT 61/11-15)

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

I thank the Member for his question. I stress that one should not put too much stock in league tables. A host of league tables in which universities are ranked are used around the world, and that is one of many. In each, different weightings are given to aspects of university life. Some, for example, place a much heavier reliance on research; others place more reliance on areas such as student satisfaction.

We have a higher education strategy in place in Northern Ireland, and we are working with the universities across a broad range of issues. As an Executive, we are investing heavily in the higher education sector and appreciate its importance to the Northern Ireland economy. I am very proud to say that Northern Ireland has three world-class universities that are really making their presence felt and are critical to our future economic potential.

Tom Buchanan (DUP, West Tyrone)

I thank the Minister for his response. I agree with him that we have world-class universities, but, in light of the apparent decline, can you advise why the external review mechanism, which would have identified issues of concern at a much earlier stage, was removed, having been in existence since the inception of the university? Is it not now time that it was replaced?

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

What I can say to the Member is that there is an ongoing dialogue between my Department, whether at ministerial or official level, and the universities. Those exchanges range from the accounting officer's engagement with the university on the use of public money to how we can achieve our mutual objectives. An indication of that is that I wrote to the vice chancellors over the summer to emphasise again the priorities that the Executive and Assembly have and expect of the higher education sector. The universities have acknowledged that and are working towards those plans. I believe that we have strength, and, again, I urge the Member not to put too much stock in an individual league table because the different measurements that people use as a means of ranking universities do not always stack up with reality.

Caitriona Ruane (Sinn Féin, South Down)

2. asked the Minister for Employment and Learning whether the recent changes to the education maintenance allowance have had an impact on the number of young people staying in further education post 16. (AQT 62/11-15)

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

I thank the Member for her question. The changes to the EMA were jointly agreed between my Department and the Department of Education and then endorsed by the Executive. They seek to better target the available resources at helping individuals from the lowest-income households to remain in education. Northern Ireland's very strong track record of having young people stay on in education is better than that in other parts of these islands, and we can be proud of that. If anything, the evidence of recent years is that the trend has been consolidated and more young people stay on. We see that in, for example, the number of applications to sit GCSEs or A levels. This is the first year of the changes, and we will see what the impact on the ground is. We were clear that there would be a reduction in the number of young people receiving EMA, but, in exchange, we are concentrating the resource on where it will make the biggest difference. We sought to address the dead weight that was in the system previously while preserving the core of the scheme.

Caitriona Ruane (Sinn Féin, South Down)

Gabhaim buíochas leis an Aire as an fhreagra sin. I thank the Minister for his answer. Is he satisfied with the level of financial advice available to students aged 16 to 19 at our post-primary and higher education institutions?

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

The Member is right to identify this as an issue that we need to be conscious of. It is more than simply an issue of how those young people engage with secondary, further or higher education. We need to encourage our young people in the best use of resources. Equally, there is an issue of ensuring that everyone is fully aware of the support that is available to them and can access that. Our various institutions will work with young people to give them that advice. We are always happy to learn lessons as to how that could be done better.

Daithí McKay (Sinn Féin, North Antrim)

3. asked the Minister for Employment and Learning what he is doing to tackle the cross-border mobility problems experienced by students, which have an educational and economic impact. (AQT 63/11-15)

The Minister will be aware from recent media articles of some of the issues and problems around cross-border student mobility.

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

I thank the Member for his interest in this. It is fair to say that the level of student flows on the island of Ireland, whether we are talking about North to South or South to North, is below its potential and is currently at a level below the more recent historical trend. So, there is certainly scope for improvement in that regard. Officials in my Department are working with their counterparts in the Department of Education and Skills in the Republic of Ireland to address those issues. The Member will be aware that the CBI and IBEC published a significant report on the matter in 2011 with, I think, 10 or 12 recommendations, a number of which are directly relevant to my Department and others to the institutions. We are working through those issues. One key issue is the recognition of the A*. I know that the Member's colleague the Minister of Education is leading on that issue. There are then issues around careers advice and making sure that young people are aware of the options that are available to them in the different jurisdictions. We recently improved the financial support for students, particularly from Northern Ireland, who wish to study in the Republic of Ireland. While we have moved to replace the payment of the registration fee with a tuition fee loan to cover that, we have a much more generous maintenance support allowance that actually allows young people to survive while doing their degree course. So, the changes are in place. What we now need to do is encourage young people to consider all the options available to them. We are not there to advocate particular courses of action but to ensure that there is a level playing field and people have the full information available.

Daithí McKay (Sinn Féin, North Antrim)

I thank the Minister for his answer. Has he discussed the matter with his counterpart in the Dublin Government, the Education and Skills Minister, Ruairí Quinn? What are his views on the matter?

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

I have discussed the matter on a number of occasions with my counterpart, Ruairí Quinn. I know that John O'Dowd has had similar discussions. In the past number of months, I have appeared before the Good Friday Agreement Committee in the Oireachtas. We had a very healthy exchange around higher education issues that also touched on some aspects of research. It is worth highlighting, given that the Member has given me the opportunity, that there is the potential to significantly improve the degree of collaboration on a North/South basis with respect to research in higher and further education settings. In particular, as we look to maximise the drawdown from competitive European Union funds, that type of collaboration is key to making the most of the available opportunities.

Ross Hussey (UUP, West Tyrone)

4. asked the Minister for Employment and Learning what action he is taking to address the number of students who are registered blind or with a serious visual impairment uncorrected by glasses, which fell from 360 in 2007-08 to only 85 in 2011-12, and the number of students who are registered deaf or with a serious hearing impairment, which fell from 250 to 100 in the same period. (AQT 64/11-15)

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

I thank the Member for his question. We are aware of those figures. I stress to the Member and the House that the further education system and higher education system are open to people irrespective of any disability or impairment that they may have, whether that is a sight or hearing issue or, indeed, a learning disability. I will highlight one particular intervention that we have made in recent weeks: the additional support fund, which is available in the further education system to provide support to young people who need assistance, has seen its budget increase by about 33%, from £1·5 million to £2 million. Hopefully, that will begin to make a difference. Ultimately, this is about encouraging people to apply to further education and to understand that assistance is available for them and there is no reason why they should be discouraged in any way from developing their own potential to its maximum.

Ross Hussey (UUP, West Tyrone)

I thank the Minister for his response. The extra £500,000 funding in the additional support fund is most welcome for potential students who have a disability. However, does the Minister believe that the allocation of funding before an audit is carried out to establish gaps in disability provision in further education is the best way forward?

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

I thank the Member for his supplementary question. He touches on a wider issue. He will be aware that we have had discussions on the issue in the Chamber and in Committee. Indeed, the Committee plans to conduct an inquiry into the issue of post-19 special educational needs.

In response to representations that I have received, we have conducted an audit of the availability of courses across the FE sector to see where there are gaps so that we can challenge those. Obviously, resources are fixed, and, while we can maybe add some additional resources, there is a limit to how far we can extend provision, but I want to see that we have, as far as possible, a uniformity of provision across Northern Ireland. The audit that we have now completed and that will hopefully pass on to the Committee in the very near future will enable us to proceed with that work.

We are looking closely at the issue over the next number of months. We are looking in particular at what happens regarding disability employment to ensure that we have the support available, so there is a review of the disability employment service offer. There is also the wider issue about what we do with young people, which cuts across Departments. I am happy to lead on my own aspects and the aspects that interface with other Departments, and I have no doubt that my colleagues in the Executive feel likewise.

Mitchel McLaughlin (Sinn Féin, South Antrim)

As Mr Paul Givan is not in his place, I call Mr Samuel Gardiner.

Samuel Gardiner (UUP, Upper Bann)

6. asked the Minister for Employment and Learning whether he agrees that the lack of creche facilities at the University of Ulster at Magee will limit study options for parents. (AQT 66/11-15)

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

I thank the Member for his question and understand the concern that he has expressed. It has been shared by a large number of other MLAs, but I need to stress to Members that this is a matter for the University of Ulster to take forward. While the Department funds the universities to a large extent and sets the high-level policy direction, they are autonomous bodies. They are not NDPBs as such or arm's-length bodies; they are autonomous from the Department, and it is for them to set their own policies. My understanding is that there was limited demand for those facilities and that can be met through other means, but it is something that, no doubt, Members will wish to keep under review and to push the university on as well.

The other aspect that we will be concerned about relates to any funds that have been allocated, whether recently or in the past. If it is appropriate, we will seek to claw those back if they are no longer being used for the purpose for which they were originally allocated.

Samuel Gardiner (UUP, Upper Bann)

I thank the Minister for his response. How is the Minister working alongside the Office of the First Minister and deputy First Minister to ensure that the childcare strategy takes account of parents who are studying in further or higher education?

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

I thank the Member for his question. Again, it touches on a much wider issue relating to childcare. He rightly identifies that OFMDFM takes the lead on a childcare strategy, and I understand that it is at a very advanced stage in that process. My Department is keen to collaborate with it on that, and we have a distinct role to ensure that we are upskilling the workforce in that regard.

I also highlight the fact that we have a commitment to widening participation in further education and higher education. That includes ensuring that people from a range of backgrounds can access the choice of courses that are available, and childcare is obviously a dimension to that.

Mitchel McLaughlin (Sinn Féin, South Antrim)

That ends the period for topical questions. We now move to the questions for oral answer that have been listed for the Minister.

Gordon Dunne (DUP, North Down)

1. asked the Minister for Employment and Learning what plans he has to increase the number of apprenticeships in local businesses in North Down. (AQO 4560/11-15)

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

There are currently 337 individuals on the ApprenticeshipsNI programme in the North Down local government district, and that ranks North Down ninth of the 26 local government areas in respect of apprenticeship numbers. I encourage all businesses in Northern Ireland to consider employing a young person and have them participate in the ApprenticeshipsNI programme.

An apprenticeship provides a unique combination of work and on- and off-the-job training, all of which is relevant to business needs. It is a cost-effective way for a business to grow a loyal and productive workforce supported by my Department, which funds the off-the-job training through a network of training providers including the six further education colleges.

It is the business that creates the employment required for an apprenticeship. To raise awareness of ApprenticeshipsNI among businesses, my Department conducted an advertising campaign earlier this year, with another burst in July ahead of the main recruitment period. That campaign focuses on the benefits of employing an apprentice.

In Northern Ireland, there are almost 9,000 apprentices on the programme, and that represents about 11 apprentices per 1,000 workers. That is well below other developed economies in Europe. Switzerland, for example, has four times the equivalent number of apprentices in its workforce. That is one of the reasons why I launched the major review of our policies on apprenticeships and youth training in February. Key aspects of that review include how to encourage small and medium-sized enterprises (SMEs) to engage with apprenticeships; how to expand apprenticeships into other sectors, such as the professions; and the role of higher apprenticeships. The outworkings of the review, which will report through a series of high-level strategic statements in the autumn, are expected to result in future policy proposals that will culminate in more businesses offering apprenticeship opportunities across Northern Ireland, including North Down.

Gordon Dunne (DUP, North Down)

I thank the Minister for his answer. Does he recognise the value of apprenticeships in developing skills and knowledge in young people? Does he recognise apprenticeships as a credible alternative to going to university?

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

Absolutely, and I daresay that we could use the Member to help us to sell this model of training. It is important to recognise that, at times, apprenticeships can be a very efficient way of training because there is a much closer match between supply and demand. They are good for companies, in that they will secure workers who are trained in the particular needs of that business, and for the young people, who will know that they have skills that are bankable in a very competitive job market and, therefore, have a better chance of holding down and sustaining a job.

The Member is also right to highlight the opportunity for higher-level apprenticeships. We need to get away from the notion of some sort of hierarchy, with an apprenticeship seen as a secondary option and something that you do if you do not do so well in your A levels or cannot get into university. We have to have parity of esteem — if I can use that phrase — between apprenticeships and higher education. People must be able to make informed choices based on good careers advice about what best suits their area.

It is interesting to note that some companies now offer parallel routes that reach more or less the same destination. Some companies take people at A level and train them up, and others take graduates and do a little bit of training. Both approaches essentially reach the same point. There are a lot of interesting experiments going on out there. We are keen to reinforce that apprenticeships — in particular, higher-level apprenticeships — are a plausible alternative to traditional higher education. By the same token, we do not rule out apprentices and will encourage them to seek to get a higher-level qualification as part of their training.

Leslie Cree (UUP, North Down)

According to DEL's statistical bulletin, the number of ApprenticeshipsNI starts fell in the years 2010, 2011 and 2012. Minister, do you agree that, if you are serious about apprenticeships, you really have to address that decline?

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

I thank the Member for pointing that out. The fact is that not enough apprenticeships are offered in Northern Ireland. That is an absolute fact, and it is one of the main reasons why we have launched this major review. I would dare to suggest that the particular figures that he mentioned are a product of the economic cycle at some of the more difficult times of the economic downturn.

I stress that an apprenticeship is a job and is dependent on employers coming forward and offering places. One of the things that we will seek to do with the review is to make it easier for employers to hire apprentices. The Member will know that we have a predominance of SMEs in our economy, and, at times, SMEs, in particular, are nervous about the perceived risks of taking on an apprentice.

We want to see what type of models we can put in place, whether some sort of financial incentive or a means by which we can spread or manage the risk, to enable more SMEs to engage with that type of training, which will be beneficial to companies.

John Dallat (Social Democratic and Labour Party, East Londonderry)

I thank the Minister for his answer, and the whole House applauds him for his efforts to break down the difference between academic and vocational education. If I am correct, I picked the Minister up as saying that there are four times as many apprentices in Switzerland. Bearing in mind the high unemployment rate among 16- to 25-year-olds, has the Minister sufficient funds to offer places on apprenticeships, and, if not, is it his intention to make a bid in the October monitoring round?

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

I thank the Member for his question and his comments on the context. It is worth noting that those countries in Europe that have the strongest footprint of vocational apprenticeship training, such as the Germanic countries, also have the lowest levels of unemployment, including youth unemployment; I am sure that that is no coincidence. There are lessons to be learned. It strays into the notion of having a much more efficient means of matching supply and demand in the economy.

The Member is also right to stress the need for additional resources as we move to expand our apprenticeship offering further. The pressure will come in two areas. First, if we move to higher-level apprenticeships, training may be more expensive than the current offer. Secondly, we may see an increased demand for the number of apprenticeships to be funded. One source of funding is the European social fund, and we are consulting on the new programme for 2014 onwards. Within that, we sought to highlight the potential for the increased funding of apprenticeships. There may be circumstances in which we need to look for more, whether from reallocations in my Department or elsewhere in the block grant. We will keep that under review.

Chris Lyttle (Alliance, Belfast East)

I thank the Minister for the update on his work on apprenticeships. What creative modes of delivery is he exploring to improve the apprenticeship offering, such as consortium delivery?

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

I thank the Member for his question. This goes back to my earlier point about how we can best encourage SMEs to engage in the process. Realistically, there will not be a situation in which every company in Northern Ireland is offering apprenticeships. I will return to Mr Dallat's point. Even in Switzerland, perhaps only some 30% of companies offer apprenticeships, and there is a skewing towards bigger companies, but there is, nonetheless, greater participation from small and medium-sized enterprises than in Northern Ireland.

Part of the difficulty is that companies may see taking on an additional pair of hands and paying the wage as too much of a risk. They may see, or be concerned about, a distraction with training, or they may be uncertain as to what they can offer when the apprenticeship finishes. A number of different models are available for us to look at on how we can spread and manage the risk. One such model could be an interim body that is the employing agency for apprentices, rather the company employing them directly. Those issues are all under consideration at present, and we still have to make a final judgement as to what is most suitable for Northern Ireland.

Mitchel McLaughlin (Sinn Féin, South Antrim)

Question 5 has been withdrawn and will receive a written answer.

Kieran McCarthy (Alliance, Strangford)

2. asked the Minister for Employment and Learning to outline the recent initiatives to address skills issues in the information and communication technology sector. (AQO 4561/11-15)

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

I thank the Member for his question. Information and communication technology (ICT) is a priority sector for my Department. In June 2012, I published an action plan to address the specific skill issues in the sector. That plan, agreed by the ICT working group, which includes representation from employers, colleges, universities and other Departments, is a living document and continues to be adapted to meet the changing needs of employers. Progress has been significant and has coincided with an increase of over 24% in applications to IT-related degrees at our local universities.

New initiatives continue to be taken forward. In the past month, I have announced new pilot academies in data analytics and cloud technology, which will offer training and work placement opportunities to 34 participants. A second cohort of the successful public-private ICT apprenticeship scheme is in motion, with around 50 places available; and a further cohort of over 100 students has enrolled on MSc courses for non-IT graduates in our local universities. Furthermore, this month, a new software and systems development A level was introduced in Northern Ireland.

Those developments build on the high level of existing activity that is being delivered as part of the ICT action plan. That includes a third cohort of 32 participants in the Software Testers Academy, who commenced training this month; a higher level apprenticeship in ICT, which is being piloted at South West College; and the wider review of apprenticeships, which will be of direct relevance to the ICT sector.

Kieran McCarthy (Alliance, Strangford)

I thank the Minister for his very positive response. I am sure the Assembly will welcome the recent initiatives that he has taken. However, we cannot rest on our laurels. What are the next steps to make further progress on this issue?

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

I thank the Member for his comments and question. I will highlight a number of points. First, we have launched a number of pilot academies, which I have no doubt will be very successful. They are in cutting-edge areas such as data analytics and cloud technology. We will want to mainstream those in due course and, indeed, expand them where appropriate.

I have touched on the review of apprenticeships. I think that that offers new opportunities, on a much bigger scale, for the ICT sector. We can also look to the forthcoming review of careers services, because, in many ways, those represent the foundation stone on which much of our economy is built, and we need to see what more we can do to encourage young people to consider careers in this flourishing sector in Northern Ireland.

Finally, the Member will note that we have seen a very significant increase in the number of applications to universities, which we welcome. There comes a point, however, when physical capacity and staffing issues come into play. We are in discussions with the universities to see what more we can do to take their offerings to the next level.

Gregory Campbell (DUP, East Londonderry)

The Minister outlined the availability of ICT schemes and courses. Does he accept that, in some hard-to-reach communities, it is about more than merely making those classes and courses available? It is about proactively seeking out people who will need qualifications to make themselves available in the job market? What is he doing to promote that?

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

I thank the Member for his question. He raises the need to maximise participation. We need to find people to go into ICT careers. We have to address the gender balance, encourage people who, perhaps, have not thought about ICT as a career and, indeed, address the needs of people who are facing particular barriers. A lot of good work has been done with communities in that regard. Obviously, when we talk about essential skills, that is not just literacy and numeracy; it is ICT. This month, we are mainstreaming LEAP across Northern Ireland. That is a community-based project that will engage with people.

A number of projects within the not in education, employment or training (NEET) strategy, Pathways to Success, and under the collaboration and innovation fund, which aim to engage with vulnerable young people or those who are facing barriers, are based around ICT. So, there is a focus on trying to touch the communities that Mr Campbell identified.

Colum Eastwood (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Foyle)

Is the Minister confident that enough places are being offered in the north-west region to meet demand or to attract all the jobs that we want in the ICT sector?

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

I think that the straight answer to the Member is that more can be done in this area, particularly in the north-west. Later this evening, we are having a debate about Magee and the potential of that university campus. I encourage much more attention to be given to the intermediate-level skills — the technical skills — for which particular demand is being voiced by employers, including those in the ICT sector. The Member will also note that, in support of the One Plan skills directorate, we recently appointed a member of my staff to act as a liaison officer. That was to provide much more focused attention on skills in the north-west.

Sandra Overend (UUP, Mid Ulster)

I thank the Minister for his responses. He referred to the ICT action plan that was launched in June 2012. Will the Minister outline the alterations that he has made to that action plan since then, considering the economic climate?

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

I thank the Member for her question. She, rightly, identifies that the action plan was never meant to sit on a shelf or be fixed in stone. We have periodic reviews of the action plan at which we bring the stakeholders together. As and when we come across a need for new initiatives, or when new initiatives are happening, we will update the plan accordingly.

I will give the Member a few examples of that. We are in a new context in which the A level is in place, which means that attention now shifts towards encouraging schools to offer that A level. At present, only a handful of schools make that choice available to young people. We have also developed a much greater focus on certain specialities, such as data analytics and cloud technology, which were mentioned earlier. That illustrates that this is a fast-moving industry and that new types of expertise can be required at relatively short notice. So it is important that we continue to have the flexibility to respond to the needs of overseas investors and indigenous companies. Those issues will be reflected in the action plan as we update it regularly.

Alasdair McDonnell (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast South)

3. asked the Minister for Employment and Learning for an update on the second stage of the study of teacher education infrastructure. (AQO 4562/11-15)

Michael McGimpsey (UUP, Belfast South)

11. asked the Minister for Employment and Learning for an update on the progress of the second stage of the study of teacher education infrastructure. (AQO 4570/11-15)

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

With your permission, Mr Principal Deputy Speaker, I will group questions 3 and 11.

Members are aware of my previous statements to the Assembly and my plans to review the teacher training infrastructure in Northern Ireland before putting forward options for further consideration. Yesterday, I announced that I had appointed Dr Pasi Sahlberg to chair an expert panel of international standing in the field of higher education and with the professional expertise to meet the objectives of the review.

Dr Sahlberg is currently director general of the Centre for International Mobility and Cooperation in the Finnish Government's Ministry of Education and Culture. He has a long track record in education and development and has been an active figure in promoting educational changes in Finland and beyond. He brings high-level strategic expertise and advice to this review. Dr Sahlberg will be supported by four other panel members, and I will make a further announcement about the other members in due course. I have placed a copy of yesterday's press release in the Assembly library.

The panel will have scope to develop its own methodology for taking the initiative forward, which, I envisage, will include engagement with representatives of the five teacher training providers. The final output from this assignment will be a report setting out the options for the future shape of initial teacher training in Northern Ireland. That will allow my officials and me to enter into further dialogue with the various institutions, with the intention of finding an agreed way forward.

Alasdair McDonnell (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast South)

I thank the Minister for his answer. Has the Department made any projections or are there any indications to the Department of any possible adverse impacts of the study on future needs? Will future needs be in any way be threatened by the line that the Department is pursuing?

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

I thank the Member for his supplementary. I can assure him that there is no danger of that in any shape or form. The Department of Education controls the teacher demand model, and it will set the numbers required.

My concerns are largely to do with the nature of the infrastructure itself. We have a multiplicity of providers for 1·8 million people, which goes against the trend in other jurisdictions; hence the need for an international perspective on what we do. We have looked at financial projections for the teacher training colleges in particular, and it is clear that they are not sustainable. Even if we do nothing, they will not be sustainable, but, in the event that other policy priorities change, that situation could come to a head even sooner. So the only responsible thing to do is to take forward this review. We will always ensure that we train teachers to meet the needs of the local market. If anything, at present, there is a surplus of trained teachers, and good efforts are being made to put some of them to good use in the area of literacy and numeracy. There is still a surplus, and we want to ensure that we invest in the right needs of our economy.

Michael McGimpsey (UUP, Belfast South)

I, of course, am keen to know where we are as far as the status of Stranmillis University College is concerned. It was my understanding that, before the summer, you appointed an expert to advise you. I now hear that this expert is the chairman of a panel that is yet to be appointed but will be "in due course", after which it will engage in a long discussion. But when I hear words like "not sustainable" and I hear about this long process, you will understand how anxious I am to find out exactly what your proposals are for Stranmillis college.

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

Again, I thank the Member for his question. We are taking a deliberative, evidence-based approach to this. I intend to appoint the rest of the panel within a matter of weeks. We simply have to confirm participation with the panel before we proceed to announce the names. We have to have a degree of caution in that regard. It is intended that the panel will report on this issue in spring 2014.

I do not think that we are taking it slowly. If anything, the mood of the Assembly was against the potential merger of Stranmillis and Queen's University. That was placed on the table by my predecessor, the colleague of Mr McGimpsey, but it was very quickly apparent that the appetite was not there to simply address the future of Stranmillis through the lens of a potential merger with Queen's. Hence, there was a need for a much wider review of the infrastructure so that we can explore all the issues, including some of the equality issues that have been raised as matters of concern by Members.

Pat Sheehan (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

Go raibh maith agat, a Phriomh-LeasCheann Comhairle. Gabhaim buíochas leis an Aire as ucht a fhreagra. I thank the Minister for his answers so far. Does the Minister intend to move forward on the basis of agreement with the institutions in question? If no agreement can be reached, does he intend to impose change?

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

I can understand why the Member is asking that question, but it is probably premature to raise that issue. My preference would obviously be to work on the basis of consensus with the various institutions. Obviously, we respect them, and they all have long and proud histories.

It is important that all the institutions engage with the review, but they must also recognise that the status quo of the system is simply not sustainable. Change is inevitable. It is better that we address change on the basis of consensus, and I believe that this process will allow for that opportunity. If people are not prepared to engage, we will have to see what happens. Even if we sit back and do nothing, the situation will change adversely as far as the future interests of the various stakeholders are concerned.

Sammy Wilson (DUP, East Antrim)

I understand the importance of the various institutions involved in teacher training, but does the Minister accept that it is imperative not to keep training teachers for unemployment? Young people are being enticed into teacher-training courses only to find that there are no jobs for them at the end. Does he accept that, if this review is to be effective, the total number of teachers required is also an important factor to be considered when making any decisions?

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

Again, I thank the Member for his question. I look forward to being grilled by him from the Back Benches over the months to come. I suspect that he has a major advantage over most other Members as he knows the ins and outs of a lot of the financial arrangements of the various Departments. No doubt, he will be forensic in his analysis of the various issues.

Having a more shared and integrated system for teacher training would be much more sustainable and would have a much higher tolerance for shifts in the numbers of teachers being trained in Northern Ireland. At present, there is a sense that the numbers being trained are as much a reflection of the need to keep institutions sustainable as they are of the needs of the economy as we move forward. To put it into very sharp focus: we are spending more money on training a teacher in Northern Ireland, when arguably we are training too many, and less on training an engineer, when arguably we need more engineers for our future growth.

Jim Allister (Traditional Unionist Voice, North Antrim)

No doubt, the Minister will say that the panel has been appointed to look at infrastructure; but nothing in education is free-standing. Is it not the case that his choice of chair, Dr Sahlberg, is a person who, from his writings, is clearly an avowed opponent of selection, an avowed opponent of any form of standardised testing and an avowed opponent even of parental choice in education? Is there an agenda here that the Minister is following with the Education Minister?

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

I am happy to give the Member an absolute categorical assurance that none of the issues that he outlined is part of the terms of reference for the stage two of the review either officially, unofficially or in any other way, and that there is certainly no conspiracy afoot regarding this being a Trojan horse for any of those other issues. The House is well familiar with those issues, and there will be separate processes for discussing those and agreeing changes, if any. However, with regard to what the Member is concerned about, he has nothing to fear whatsoever.

Bronwyn McGahan (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

4. asked the Minister for Employment and Learning for an update on discussions between his Department and private sector representatives to improve the provision and success of apprenticeship schemes. (AQO 4563/11-15)

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

In the main, discussions between my Department and private sector representatives to improve the provision and success of apprenticeship schemes have been within the context of the review of apprenticeships that I announced in February 2013. However, discussions have not focused solely on private sector representatives. I instructed DEL officials to engage with a wide range of stakeholders, including young people, the voluntary and community sector, sector skills representatives and training providers.

I established an expert panel, which includes employers and education and skills providers, to advise on the work of the review. That has now met three times regarding apprenticeships and once focusing on youth training. Alongside that, my officials have met individual businesses and sector skills councils, and have worked with partners, including the CBI and the Federation of Small Businesses, to engage directly with that sector.

I recently facilitated a series of stakeholder forums for employers, learners and providers, which have provided an opportunity for key stakeholders to help shape the review. A call for submissions on the review of apprenticeships was launched on 4 September. There will be a similar call for submissions on the review of youth training.

Bronwyn McGahan (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

I thank the Minister for his response. It is my understanding that Electrical Training Trust students are unable to enrol in regional colleges to pursue apprenticeships, and that that is having an impact on their potential careers. Is the Minister planning to factor that into his review of apprenticeships?

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

I thank the Member for her supplementary question. She touches on one aspect of a much more multifaceted problem, and a number of MLAs have been in touch with me in recent months to highlight that. At times, the rules around the current model of apprenticeships can be somewhat stifling, and sometimes they may be perceived as being slightly illogical and may frustrate people's opportunities and their chances for progression. I assure the Member that, with regard to the current review, every single aspect of apprenticeship policy is on the table. Although we talk about the broad sweep regarding the headline changes that we want to make, we also want to look at the particular rules around apprenticeships that have caused some frustration, not only for Members but for young people across Northern Ireland.

Robin Newton (DUP, Belfast East)

Does the Minister agree that, given the very high number of people who are unemployed in this potential apprenticeship group, there is virtually a social responsibility on many of our medium to large companies, particularly those in receipt of, in many cases, large amounts of financial support from DEL, to take up that social responsibility and provide an opportunity for training places?

Stephen Farry (Alliance, North Down)

I fully agree with the Member. To give a specific example: there is now a much greater use of social clauses, which include aspects of engagement with apprenticeships, in public procurement contracts. The broader point stands, in that companies have a duty to invest in the future of the economy as a whole, and that includes investing in young people. Sometimes you will see some companies overtraining in the sense that they have an expectation that they may not hire everybody in due course, but that they will be available for the rest of the sector or, indeed, their supply chain. However, I would not wish employers to simply see this as a social responsibility. Hiring an apprentice adds to the bottom line of a business. Depending on the complexity of the training needs, an employer may well break even on productivity after a year. In a more complex area, that may be two years. However, an employer will get a productivity gain directly from employing an apprentice. So, they can employ an apprentice out of a sense of corporate social responsibility, but they can also do so in their own direct economic interest.

Mitchel McLaughlin (Sinn Féin, South Antrim)

Again, we will start with topical questions. Mr Fra McCann was listed first, but he contacted the Business Office within the appropriate time and withdrew his name, so I call Mr Seán Lynch.

Sean Lynch (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

2. asked the Minister of Health, Social Services and Public Safety whether he agrees that his Department has failed children in care and whether he intends to hold an inquiry into children in care here. (AQT 72/11-15)

Edwin Poots (DUP, Lagan Valley)

The blame for the circumstances that we find ourselves in lies first and foremost with the perpetrators, not the Department. The blame should always lie first and foremost with the perpetrators of sexual or any other kind of violence.

Over the past number of years, the Department asked Barnardo's to produce a report and paid for that report to be produced in 2009 because we recognised that there was a risk. Subsequently, we took a series of actions, including establishing the Safeguarding Board for Northern Ireland.

Not all the responsibility lies with the Department. The police and the Department of Justice have a role. When young people themselves do not believe that they are the victims of violence or sexual violence, you have a great difficulty. Many of those young people wrongly perceive that they are being appreciated and shown some kind of care and attention when they are really receiving malign attention from people who have evil purposes.

So, let us be very clear about where the blame lies. It lies with people who go after young, vulnerable people. It is not just children in care, because 80% of children who are targeted by child sexual exploiters are not in care, and we need to get the appropriate messages out.

Sean Lynch (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

Go raibh maith agat. Gabhaim buíochas leis an Aire as an fhreagra sin. Can the Minister assure the public that children in care today are safe?

Edwin Poots (DUP, Lagan Valley)

It is important to indicate that children in residential care homes are in homes. That is why they are not locked up: it is to be a home, not a prison. Therefore, young people have the ability to exercise some discretion and free will. We identified that those young people who were most vulnerable, and who, for a variety of reasons, we took to secure accommodation, quickly reverted to how they behaved previously. Clearly, locking up young people does not work.

It is a difficult situation. We will highlight repeatedly to young people the issues and problems that can come to them as a result of engaging with the wrong types of people, how to avoid them, what to watch out for and when to seek support. We will also continue to work with the police. It is important that we recognise that, in all of this, I am sure that we can move things forward and improve things. The care of young people has improved over the past 10 years and over the previous 10 years. I have no doubt that we will be doing things in future years that will be better than today. We need to ensure that we pay heed to everything that comes to our attention and that we act on it. That is what we seek to do daily.

Jim Allister (Traditional Unionist Voice, North Antrim)

3. asked the Minister of Health, Social Services and Public Safety whether he will give statutory residential care homes for the elderly a chance and an opportunity to prove their viability by doing a U-turn on his policy of restricting new admissions. (AQT 73/11-15)

Edwin Poots (DUP, Lagan Valley)

The policy of restricted admissions is something that a number of trusts applied but not all. Last year, for example, the Western Health and Social Care Trust had an open admissions policy. Eighty per cent of people in the Western Trust area chose not to use statutory residential homes and opted for private residential homes, so Mr Allister's point does not resolve the issue. With residential care homes for the elderly, we need to look at the widest range of options for our elderly population and seek to meet their needs. The person, not the facility, should be front and centre of all those things — the needs of that person and where best their needs are met. If their needs are best met in a statutory residential care home, I am not opposed to that.

Jim Allister (Traditional Unionist Voice, North Antrim)

The Minister likes to hide behind the trusts on the issue. However, his policy is to restrict admissions. On 9 October 2012, when he introduced Transforming Your Care, he told the House that there would, therefore, be a restriction on new admissions to statutory care homes. That is starving homes of the oxygen of occupancy that makes them capable of working. Take, for example, Pinewood Residential Care Home in my constituency. It is a 36-bed unit that has been starved of admissions to the point that it now has nine residents. Is the Minister not, quite clearly, clinging to a policy that is designed to close those homes? Why does he fear lifting that ban to let those homes prove themselves?

Edwin Poots (DUP, Lagan Valley)

In case Mr Allister takes the Assembly down the wrong line, he will find that there are more than nine residents in Pinewood, albeit that there are nine permanent residents. Many people use the facility for respite care. I just want to clarify that matter. Had Mr Allister had his way and the trust made its recommendations, does he honestly think that a direct rule Minister would have stepped in as I did? The truth is that Mr Allister's policy would have ensured the closure of Pinewood Residential Care Home. [Interruption.]

Jim Allister (Traditional Unionist Voice, North Antrim)

You went through the Northern Trust 100%. You sat on your hands over it.

Edwin Poots (DUP, Lagan Valley)

Mr Allister does not like the truth. He does not like the facts. That is why he is behaving as he is.

Mitchel McLaughlin (Sinn Féin, South Antrim)

Order.

Edwin Poots (DUP, Lagan Valley)

I wish that Mr Allister and, indeed, anybody else in the Assembly would visit some of the new facilities that we have developed. Recently, I opened one in Downpatrick. I visited one in Carrickfergus, which is not very far from Mr Allister's constituency. I urge people to gain a little knowledge on the subject about the standards of care that we might be able to offer our elderly population, which is a higher standard of care than is currently in place. Talk to the residents, staff and families, who will say that those facilities are much better — [Interruption.] — rather than unnecessarily hyping up and scaring elderly people in residential care homes.

Mitchel McLaughlin (Sinn Féin, South Antrim)

Listen: if you ask a question of the Minister, you should have the manners to listen to the answer.

Alastair Ross (DUP, East Antrim)

4. asked the Minister of Health, Social Services and Public Safety, given the continued coverage of the issue of organ donation, whether he will provide an update on the survey work that his Department is carrying out about public attitudes toward organ donation in Northern Ireland. (AQT 74/11-15)

Edwin Poots (DUP, Lagan Valley)

Over the early summer, the Public Health Agency team conducted a face-to-face survey of the public, with a representative sample of 1,012 individuals, which is fairly large. That was done on the basis of age, gender, social class and local government district, so it was widespread. Focus groups and stakeholder engagement also took place with health service staff, the BMA, charities, recipients, those on waiting lists and donor families. That work has now concluded, and I understand that the team has finalised a report on its findings. Some interesting views on organ donation are emerging. There is a lot of work to be done with the public on the issue to ensure that we can move and advance forward to ensure that more organ donation takes place in Northern Ireland with the support of the public.

Alastair Ross (DUP, East Antrim)

Will the Minister confirm that that report will be published? Will he indicate to the House when he anticipates that that will be done? Are there any early findings that would be of particular interest to the Assembly?

Edwin Poots (DUP, Lagan Valley)

I understand that the all-party group on organ donation meets next week. We would be very happy to make the report available to that group, and I think that that meeting would be an appropriate opportunity to do so. I have no doubt that the Public Health Agency team will make itself available to make a presentation if requested to do so. I appreciate the public and political interest in this issue. If it is not possible for the all-party group to receive the report next week, I will endeavour to have it published in the very near future. I think that the public need to know what the responses were, and we need to give attention to what the public say on these issues. As the survey was of a representative sample, it will indicate very clearly where the Northern Ireland public stand on the issue.

Chris Lyttle (Alliance, Belfast East)

5. asked the Minister of Health, Social Services and Public Safety why he is using scarce public funds for legal cases against blood donation and adoption when his responsibility is to deliver a system that assesses the health and safety of blood donation and decides whether parental placements are in the best interests of a child. (AQT 75/11-15)

As this is my first topical question, I wish to extend my thanks to the staff of the Committee on Procedures, who undertook to develop my proposal to introduce topical questions. I also extend my gratitude to my Assembly researcher, Gareth Scott, whose idea it was to proceed down this route. I think that it is worth putting that on the record.

Edwin Poots (DUP, Lagan Valley)

I thank the Member for his modesty. [Laughter.] There is an old saying: "Self-praise is no recommendation".

On the issues that the Member raised, I was not aware that I went to court with anyone. However, when someone takes you to court, you have to respond; it would be quite foolish not to do so. It is very interesting that public money is being used by the Northern Ireland Human Rights Commission, which is a publicly funded body, in taking the Government to court, and legal aid is being used. We await the outcome of one of those cases in the not-too-distant future. Let us just see what happens.

On the issue of gay adoption, let us be absolutely unequivocal: I am just after saying that we need to pay attention to the public when they speak. When the direct rule Minister held a consultation, it revealed that over 95% of the community was opposed to gay adoption. It strikes me that some Assembly Members would prefer the courts, as opposed to this House, to make decisions. With respect to the courts, the Assembly is elected to represent the people of Northern Ireland, and it is a crucial part of the democratic process. We would do well to pay attention to the democratic will, and that is exactly what I am doing. I have to say that my stance was further strengthened last week when a piece of Queen's University Belfast research on looked-after children was published by the British Association for Adoption and Fostering. The longitudinal report, started in 2003 and published only last week, found that 99% of children who had been adopted here had stability — 99% of children in adoptive circumstances in Northern Ireland find stability.

Mitchel McLaughlin (Sinn Féin, South Antrim)

I remind the Minister that the two-minute rule applies.

Edwin Poots (DUP, Lagan Valley)

I am very sorry, Mr Principal Deputy Speaker. That was because — the report included this — of the rigorous assessment process that takes place. So I make no apologies for not repairing something that is not broken in the first place.

Chris Lyttle (Alliance, Belfast East)

I thank the Minister for his response and his emphasis on the need for rigorous assessment. How can the public be confident that he is using public funds in a responsible manner when he continues to lose legal proceedings on these issues?

Edwin Poots (DUP, Lagan Valley)

That is a matter for the courts in the decisions that they make and the arguments that are put. Let me be absolutely clear: the European Court of Human Rights has found that there is no human right to adopt. Let us just nail that at the outset. This is not about adopters; it is about the children.

In Northern Ireland, we are in a different circumstance from the rest of the United Kingdom, in that we do not have as many children on the waiting list for adoption as is the case in England, Scotland and Wales. Northern Ireland has a very robust adoption system, and I would have brought and am prepared to bring adoption legislation to the House to upgrade and improve it. However, because others decided to rush to court, that has been delayed. That is damaging to democracy, and I would have thought that Mr Lyttle should be a defender of democracy instead of trying to do down democracy. He may wish to do things through the courts; I would rather do things through the ballot box.

Mitchel McLaughlin (Sinn Féin, South Antrim)

That is the end of the period for topical questions. We will now move on to questions for oral answer.

Karen McKevitt (Social Democratic and Labour Party, South Down)

1. asked the Minister of Health, Social Services and Public Safety for his assessment of the total number of elderly people who will be living in statutory and private care homes in three, five and ten years from now. (AQO 4573/11-15)

Edwin Poots (DUP, Lagan Valley)

It is not possible to make exact predictions of that nature. Demand for residential and nursing home care is dependent on a range of variables, including levels of disability, the prevalence of conditions such as dementia and the availability of alternative forms of support such as domiciliary care. Moving forward, I fully support the general principle that home should be the hub of care for older people. I want a shift away from the provision of care in institutional settings to the provision of treatment, care and support closer to home. As the policy takes effect, I expect more of our older people to be supported to maintain their independence in their own home.

In August 2013, the Health and Social Care Board, as part of its project titled Improving Services for Older People — A New Process for Consulting, Engaging and Implementing Change, published a project initiation document on the future of statutory residential homes. As part of that project, the board is in the process of developing criteria that will likely include a measurement of the demand for statutory residential care that could be applied locally at trust level. The criteria will be subject to public consultation in the near future. However, I want to provide an assurance that that does not mean that residential and nursing home care will not be available in the future. I fully recognise that, for some people, support in their home may not be the best option, and HSC will work with providers in the independent and voluntary and community sectors to ensure the continued supply of residential and nursing home care.

Karen McKevitt (Social Democratic and Labour Party, South Down)

In the absence of statutory homes, how does the Minister intend to provide vulnerable elderly people with the level of care that they require?

Edwin Poots (DUP, Lagan Valley)

In a range of ways. First, we should always seek to give people the option of staying in their home by providing appropriate and adequate support. Direct payment can be one means if people have strong support from families and can utilise that as a much more flexible service than the one we offer from the statutory sector.

Secondly, we need to ensure that we look at the option of providing supported living facilities, and that is a growing trend. I mentioned the very successful example in Downpatrick, which is in the Member's constituency. I urge her to visit that facility because I think that she would be wholly impressed by the service provided there.

Finally, we have the option of the private sector and, as things stand, the option of the statutory residential sector as well.

Gregory Campbell (DUP, East Londonderry)

Fionnuala McAndrew from the Health and Social Care Board was interviewed last month, Minister, and, when questioned, she indicated that no elderly residents would be forced to leave their home. Can the Minister reassure residents, such as my constituents in Thackeray Place in Limavady, that that is the case and refute those who are party politicking and using elderly residents for their own ends?

Edwin Poots (DUP, Lagan Valley)

Thackeray Place is one of the strongest homes and one of the homes with the strongest cases for remaining open well into the future because it is very heavily occupied, with some 27 or 28 of 32 permanent places filled. That facility is clearly very popular in the local community. In these situations, you often look at what alternatives are available, and I do not believe that an alternative is available in Limavady town itself. All those issues are taken into account.

We are engaged in a process. The other process was flawed — I want to be clear about that — and that is why I stopped it. The process that we are engaged in is not about forcing people out of their home; it is about improving the lives of older people and giving them a wider range of options. In doing that, it is important that we take steps that will allow us to make that investment in providing better options for older people in the future, but, at the same time, it is critical that we treat those older people who are currently in residential care with the greatest respect and decorum. I accept that that did not happen, and I do not wish for that failure to happen again.

Roy Beggs (UUP, East Antrim)

As a Back-Bencher in 2009, the Minister fought for the retention of statutory residential homes, yet his current policy proposes their closure. How will the Minister ensure that residential care homes remain affordable and locally accessible to family and friends? How does he explain his U-turn?

Edwin Poots (DUP, Lagan Valley)

That is something for the Health and Social Care Board. It is doing work that is looking at what is available to older people and what the best options are. I have had the opportunity to look at the supported-living model, and it is something that, I believe, will deliver a much better service for older people; one where they can retain a greater degree of independence and have the support that is necessary. I can give an example of an elderly couple, one of whom develops dementia. They do not need to go into a home; they can move into a supported-living facility. As their need increases, the support for them will increase. That couple would be able to stay together, as opposed to one of them having to move into a residential care home while the other stays in their own home.

If Members think that that is not a good thing, and that that policy is wrong, I would love to hear them state that belief clearly. I believe that the policy is right, and I believe that we need to go down this route of doing things in a very structured way, unlike the Member's colleague who did things in an unstructured way and closed six or seven residential homes in his period as Health Minister, without any opposition from Mr Beggs.

John McCallister (UUP, South Down)

Has the Minister had any discussions with the Secretary of State for Health in England or the Finance Minister here about the effect that a cap on residential funding, such as that paid by people in England, would have on the Budget here if he were to introduce it?

Edwin Poots (DUP, Lagan Valley)

I have not had direct conversations with the Health Minister on that. Normally, these things are dealt with through the Department for Social Development, and it is not my role to stand on other Ministers' toes. It will have an impact on me, so there would have to be contact with my Department if the Department for Social Development were to do anything. I would express an opinion on that when it would come to me.

Mitchel McLaughlin (Sinn Féin, South Antrim)

Question 2 has been withdrawn and referred to DSD for written answer.

Michaela Boyle (Sinn Féin, West Tyrone)

3. asked the Minister of Health, Social Services and Public Safety what analysis, linked to multiple deprivation indicators, is undertaken to monitor the effects of Transforming Your Care on people in deprived areas. (AQO 4575/11-15)

Edwin Poots (DUP, Lagan Valley)

While we have seen many improvements in the health of our population, those who are disadvantaged in our society do not have an equal chance of experiencing good health and well-being. Health and Social Care alone cannot fully address the issues associated with multiple deprivation; it requires joined-up working across government. One of the key principles underpinning Transforming Your Care (TYC) is a commitment to a focus on prevention and tackling inequalities. Changes to service provision through TYC, such as improved integration of care through the implementation of integrated care partnerships and the provision of enhanced services locally through primary and community care, will improve the health and well-being of all of our population and contribute to overall progress in respect of deprivation indicators.

TYC is a key element of our wider, holistic approach to tackling inequalities. We already have a wide range of activities under way to target the vulnerable and disadvantaged across Northern Ireland, including strategies and action plans with a wide range of associated indicators in respect of smoking, teenage parenthood and sexual health, mental health promotion and suicide prevention, obesity, and alcohol and drug misuse, as well as the forthcoming new public health strategic framework. We must all work together to ensure that we optimise life chances for everyone in Northern Ireland.

Michaela Boyle (Sinn Féin, West Tyrone)

Go raibh maith agat, a Phríomh-LeasCheann Comhairle. Will an equality impact assessment (EQIA) be conducted for specific services of Transforming Your Care, and is there a timescale for that?

Edwin Poots (DUP, Lagan Valley)

Our Department, as always, will follow all the guidelines related to equality issues, but let me talk a little bit about equality. If we want to truly change where we are, we have to go back to the starting point: the starting point is when a young person is born. I am very committed to ensuring that we give young people the best possible chance in life. I hope that Sinn Féin will be equally committed in the Departments that it has responsibility for to ensuring that those young people have the best opportunities for life, unlike the circumstances in west Belfast and the Shankill, where I had to step in because funding was not being supported by the Department of Education, which is led by a Sinn Féin Minister. It took a DUP man to sort out the people on the Falls Road.

Dolores Kelly (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Upper Bann)

What are the Minister's thoughts on the health action zones, which many recognise as having been a success in directing cross-departmental work in deprived areas? Does he have any replacement model in mind for the future?

Edwin Poots (DUP, Lagan Valley)

In all these things to do with deprivation, we have to first identify the nature of the problem and then seek to address it in a very focused way. I do not think that having Northern Ireland-wide policies, as such, does that, so the advantages of health action zones are fairly obvious in that instance. They give you a local perspective, and then you can deliver a local response.

In all that we do, we will seek not to have a broad brush approach to tackling these issues. Anti-smoking and such activities, for example, will cross the Province. In determining the nature of the problem of school truancy, for example, we know that it impacts on young people's health. If you have high levels of truancy in one area, we can focus on that and target what is going on. People smoking during pregnancy is a much greater issue in some areas than in others, so you have a particular focus on that. It is absolutely crucial that we seek to get as much qualitative information as possible to tackle inequalities in a very focused way that makes best use of the limited resource.