Northern Ireland Assembly, 23 November 2020

383 contributions from 59 members. The official report.

Assembly Business

Alex Maskey (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

I have been informed by the Chief Electoral Officer that Ms Nicola Brogan has been returned as a Member of the Assembly for the West Tyrone constituency to fill the vacancy resulting from the resignation of Ms Catherine Kelly. This morning, Ms Brogan signed the Roll of Membership in the presence of myself and the Clerk to the Assembly and entered her designation. Ms Brogan has now taken her seat, and I welcome her to the Assembly and wish her every success.

Speaker's Business

Alex Maskey (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

Before we proceed, I welcome the fact that we start our business today with two statements from Ministers on decisions taken by the Executive in relation to the current situation. We are obviously aware that these matters inevitably have an impact on the wider community, and all Members will have heard views from a range of perspectives over the weekend. I think that, right across the House, we all recognise that there are very difficult decisions to be made and that, given the variety of the issues involved, there are no easy choices. Therefore, it is very positive and appropriate that we have Ministers in the Chamber to address the issues and to take questions from Members before we move on to any other matters. Thank you.

Mervyn Storey (DUP, North Antrim)

On a point of order, Mr Speaker. Over the weekend, it was confirmed that Sinn Féin had emailed thousands of party members and supporters to tell them that the wake for Bobby Storey would be public. That is at odds with what the deputy First Minister told the Committee for the Executive Office on 1 July: "We actively discouraged people". Mr Speaker, I ask you to inform the House about what sanctions the House has on Ministers who mislead a Committee of the Assembly and show a total and blatant disregard for the rules and regulations of the House during the crisis.

Alex Maskey (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

The Member will be aware that it is not for the Speaker to adjudicate on comments that people have made or are alleged to have made elsewhere. Therefore, it is not appropriate. The issue has been discussed and, no doubt, will be discussed again; in fact, I have previously taken an taken a question for urgent oral answer to the deputy First Minister that was debated in the Chamber, so it is not as if the matter has not been discussed. I have no doubt that, because it is being looked at and dealt with in other places, it will return to the Chamber at a future date. The Member has made his point on the record.

Paul Givan (DUP, Lagan Valley)

On a point of order, Mr Speaker. The Justice Minister slipped out on Friday a decision in which she said that she did not have sufficient information to consider Gerry Kelly's grossly offensive tweet. Has the Minister advised the Speaker's Office of whether she has any intention of providing a statement to the Assembly to explain the position that she has taken?

Alex Maskey (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

I have not received any correspondence on the matter from the Minister of Justice, or from anyone else.

Ministerial Statements

Alex Maskey (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

I have received notice from the Minister of Health that he wishes to make a statement. Before I call the Minister, I remind Members that, in the light of social distancing being observed by parties, the Speaker's ruling that Members must be in the Chamber to hear a statement if they wish to ask a question has been relaxed. Members do still have to make sure that their name is on the speaking list if they wish to be called, but they can do that by rising in their place, as well as by notifying the Business Office or Speaker's Table directly. I remind Members to be concise in asking their question, as long introductions are not necessary or appropriate.

Robin Swann (UUP, North Antrim)

As the House is aware, the Northern Ireland Executive have decided to introduce tighter restrictions to break the chains of infection of COVID-19. The measures were detailed in a written statement to Members that I issued following last Thursday’s Executive meeting. They take effect from first thing this Friday morning for two weeks.

In summary, we will in large part revert to the lockdown situation that applied earlier this year during the first surge of the pandemic. The major difference is that schools will remain open. I will set out the rationale for the new restrictions. In summary, they are essential to preventing a further spike in infections overwhelming our hospitals. The onus is now on all of us to follow strictly the public health advice and to comply with the letter and the spirit of the tightened restrictions. We can each play a part in saving lives and preventing avoidable deaths. That is how serious this is and how high the stakes are.

As a society, we can now look forward to 2021 with some optimism, given the progress made towards mass vaccination. I do not want to have to look a grieving relative in the eye next year and say, "Yes, we could've taken action before Christmas and that would have saved your loved one’s life". I do not want to have to say, "I am sorry that we did not intervene. I am sorry that they are not here with us to enjoy these better days".

Today, I make a heartfelt plea for unity around the Chamber. The public are watching and looking to us for united leadership. It is, of course, the duty of the Chamber to hold the Executive to account and to scrutinise policy decisions without fear or favour. That is the Assembly’s job. There are strong and legitimate opinions, and feelings have run high. That does not mean, however, that we have to descend into party political point-scoring. This is far too important an issue for that. To say that the past few weeks have not seen devolution at its best is something of an understatement. Frustration and anger are widespread. We could spend hours in the Chamber raking over the ashes of the decisions that were made and not made. I have made my views known both inside and outside the Executive. Nevertheless, I fail to see where another bout of division and recrimination would get us now. What good would it do? Whose cause would it serve? We could also spend hours pointing fingers about years of underfunding of Health and Social Care (HSC) and years of underinvesting in staff, but, again, what would that achieve today?

I trust that everyone in the House is united in wanting the new restrictions to work. We have to give our hospitals and our heroic staff some vital breathing space. If we successfully drive down infection rates, we have the opportunity of having a better Christmas. It will not be a normal festive season by any means, but we all have the power to help change the atmosphere. We can do that by abiding by the new restrictions and strictly following public health advice. I urge all Members to promote public health messaging at every opportunity. Please do not undermine it. Please choose your words carefully, both inside and outside the House, today and in the coming days and weeks.

Let us remember that many countries, including near neighbours and, indeed, large swathes of Europe, are currently in lockdown. Those include countries with health services different from ours. We should not kid ourselves that we are so special or so unique that we can avoid taking similarly tough decisions. We cannot simply wish this virus away.

The paper that I presented to the Executive last week made the case for strengthening restrictions in light of the path that the pandemic is taking. With schools open and existing restrictions in place, the R rate had settled at around 1 by last week. That meant that we had reached approximate equilibrium with regard to community transmission of the virus. There has been a sustained reduction in the number of cases per day since the onset of restrictions, but numbers of cases, admissions, hospital inpatients, ICU occupancy and deaths remain at a relatively high level. In particular, hospital inpatients are at a higher level than was reached in wave 1 and have been declining only very slowly. As a consequence, the hospital system and staff remain under serious pressure.

By last week, we were on the verge of permitting a significant relaxation of COVID-19 restrictions. It was highly likely that that would have resulted in the R rate rising significantly above 1, with a subsequent increase in cases, admissions, inpatients and ICU occupancy in December. That increase in transmission would have occurred from a relatively high baseline, meaning that an already serious situation would have rapidly become much worse. Without decisive intervention, the hospital system would have been at risk of being overwhelmed in mid- to late December. To care for the increasing number of critically ill COVID-19 patients, we would have been forced to halt some, or even all, planned activity for other conditions, some of which are urgent in nature. We would be facing the prospect of a significant increase in both COVID-19 and non-COVID-19 deaths. In such circumstances, it is also likely that even a full lockdown, beginning around 14 December, would have been insufficient to prevent the current levels of hospital pressure being significantly exceeded. That is the bleak picture that the Executive were faced with last week, and that is the context for the lengthy and difficult discussions that we had.

I know that Members will ask whether other measures could have been deployed. The reality is that, given our current position and the rates of transmission, there are no feasible alternatives. As I have stated, other countries with different health services from ours have arrived at the same conclusion during the second surge in Europe. There has been considerable interest in the potential of rapid mass testing to reduce the transmission of the virus. However, it is important to recognise that that is largely based on theoretical considerations and that there has been, as yet, no clear demonstration anywhere in the world that mass testing can significantly reduce transmission in a short period against the background of a high level of community transmission. Modelling suggests that repeated mass testing of most of the population would be required to maintain control of transmission by that means. That would mean a very high degree of population buy-in and would present huge logistical challenges. Slovakia and Liverpool required military logistical support to deliver their programmes and at least a two-week run-in period before the testing was implemented. It remains unclear whether the required number of tests would be available to us in Northern Ireland. However, I have written and spoken to the Secretary of State for Health, Matt Hancock, to request four million rapid lateral flow device tests for Northern Ireland.

I want to see us playing a pivotal role in the UK pilot on mass testing. My ambition is evident. At the same time, it needs to be remembered that we are still at the stage of pilot programmes. They will help us to assess the effectiveness and accuracy of rapid testing technologies. Reliance on mass testing alone would represent a high-risk approach in the run-up to Christmas. It may not be viable for logistical or test-supply reasons. However, there may be scope to target more limited mass testing to high-risk areas. That would be of help, but, again, it would not avoid the need for Northern Ireland-wide restrictions at this time. Mass testing is an exciting development, and, together with a vaccine, it offers great hope for a way out of our nightmare. However, it is not a panacea; certainly not at this time, and certainly not without restrictions in place before Christmas.

Enhancing hospital capacity is also cited in some quarters as the answer. In theory, measures to increase hospital capacity would allow an increased epidemic level to be managed without a further lockdown. However, that would inevitably be associated with increased deaths and might be limited by the need of staff to self-isolate, as a consequence of healthcare-related outbreaks in hospitals, or clusters and outbreaks in the community. It is also the case that the associated levels of community transmission would inevitably result in a further significant increase in outbreaks in care homes, among extremely vulnerable older people, as was experienced in the first wave, which would result in excess deaths in that population.

For practical purposes, it is simply not possible to increase hospital capacity in the short to medium term. The key factor here is the supply of staff and, given the specialist skill set required, there is a long lead-in time for this. While some marginal gains in capacity can be made in specific areas such as ICU, they come at the cost of reduced capacity elsewhere in the system and involve the redeployment of existing staff. In addition, when doubling times of cases are in the region of seven to 10 days, even a doubling of hospital capacity, were it achievable, would buy only a limited period of relief before intervention was required.

It is, of course, important to give people hope as we face into this most difficult of winters. There are real grounds for optimism, given the progress on vaccines, the development of rapid mass testing and improvements in treatments.

I need to be candid with the public. I will not offer false hope or pretend that there are shortcuts available to get us through these next few months. We all have to hunker down and play our part in abiding by restrictions, staying at home, working at home when possible, cutting our contacts, keeping our distance, wearing a face covering and washing our hands. We can do that. We must do that.

The restrictions that start on Friday will make a difference. We all have to play our part in making them work, by our words and deeds, and that includes everyone in the Chamber. The Executive must now put the last few weeks behind them. These are extremely difficult decisions. Governments around the world are grappling with the same awful dilemmas, but we need a collective spirit and a unified purpose, not just in the Chamber but across society.

Everyone across Northern Ireland must do their bit. We can help change the course of this pandemic. We can help save lives. Hope is on the horizon, and a happier new year stands before us. Let us do all we can to make sure that as many of us as possible get to enjoy much better times in 2021.

Colm Gildernew (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle agus gabhaim buíochas leis an Aire. I thank the Minister for his statement, and for discussing it with me and the Deputy Chair of the Committee this morning. I also thank him for acknowledging the efforts that staff are making at present in dealing with the pandemic. When did the Minister first bring these restrictions, closing non-essential retail and hospitality, to the Executive?

Robin Swann (UUP, North Antrim)

A paper was presented to the Executive for the meeting on Thursday. It was circulated two days or a day before, as is normal practice —. Sorry; I apologise to the Chair. It was circulated to members of the Executive the night before, when the paper was finalised. The Executive met the following morning.

I am led to believe that the BBC had the paper before the Executive had the opportunity to discuss it. I want to make this point. One of the challenges to decision-making in the five-party Executive is enhanced and amplified by the running commentary that comes from the Executive to multiple strains of the media. We should be making those challenging, difficult decisions within a space closed for discussion. However, papers are transcribed and transmitted, often through social media, before our conversation has finished. Whoever it is and whatever avenue is providing that information out of the Executive, it is not helping the cause that we are trying to achieve in coming to a united purpose.

Pam Cameron (DUP, South Antrim)

I thank the Minister for the statement to the House this morning. We certainly do not underestimate the job of work that the Executive have to do in making these very difficult decisions.

For practical purposes, it is simply not possible to increase hospital capacity in the short to medium term. The key factor in that is the supply of staff, as we know. Given the special skill set required, there is a very long lead-in time for that. What is the lead-in time for the training of staff? Was the eight months, between the first wave and now, not long enough to increase staff numbers? Has the workforce appeal not achieved the supply of additional key staff members who will be required to help during this next wave?

Robin Swann (UUP, North Antrim)

I thank the Member for her point. When we talk about the wave, the timeline often gets confused. It is nine months since the first. The first case of COVID in Northern Ireland was in February, so it is nine months since that case. We have been through a wave; we have been through the first pandemic, which lasted for months. We saw a return to a glimmer of normality only in July or August, when our staff were already overwhelmed, over-exhausted and at a point where they needed a break. To train an ICU nurse, an anaesthetist, a doctor or anyone in the short space of a few months is not practical or possible. I am sure that many of the colleges that register professionals will make that same point.

The workforce appeal was launched again in the approach to the second phase of the pandemic. The appeal has been a more targeted approach to the skill sets that we need. As of last week, we had received 3,157 applications, and 516 of those are tentative job-ready offered or actually appointed. Over 600 applications have been rejected as they do not meet the skill set or are not applicable for the position. There is a balance in the workforce appeal working. It is not possible to get an increase in the highly professional skills that we need — that is the ICU nurse, the anaesthetist and the respiratory ward professionals — in that time. We see that across all jurisdictions. In parts of England and Wales, the Nightingale facilities cannot be opened because they do not have the skilled workforce. They have the premises, but they do not have the staff.

As I said earlier — I have said it many times — when this place came back on 11 January, one of the collective achievements was the agreement to invest in our health workforce. The Executive put in an additional 300 nursing training places per year, over the next three years. However, it takes a number of years for them to come through that basic training, never mind getting the enhanced skill set that is needed to operate in our ICUs, with anaesthetists and the additional workforce there. Our workforce really is stepping up at this time, and it is incumbent on us to give it as much support as we possibly can.

Colin McGrath (Social Democratic and Labour Party, South Down)

I welcome the cohesive tone of today's statement. I hope that all Executive Ministers can pick up on that tone and use it. Last week was an embarrassment to us all and was not of our making as MLAs. To have faith in the message, we must have faith in the messengers.

What avenue is the Department taking to explore how to better detail the public message? Families are really concerned about Christmas. They want to know exactly what they can and cannot do, and they need to know that soon. Does the Minister have a sense of how that message will be detailed to the public?

Robin Swann (UUP, North Antrim)

I thank the Member. One of the messages comes from Christmas, and it is not simply about family gatherings; it is about hope, faith and belief. That is the message that we need to portray for this Christmas. How do we do that collectively?

I was involved in a meeting on Saturday with the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster, our First Minister and deputy First Minister, the First Minister of Scotland, the First Minister of Wales and a number of Chief Medical Officers on how we get what we do at Christmas the same across these islands. I am glad that there has been an ongoing conversation between Her Majesty's Government in London and the Irish Government to make sure that we come to a collective message across these islands to ensure that families get as much continuity of messaging as possible, especially at that time. For Christmas, we should take not only a message of hope and encouragement but a message of faith and trust. We need to instil that message, and our Executive and our Assembly need to put that message out with a unified voice for our people. Although times are tough and will be tough over the next couple of weeks, with everything that is coming, a new dawn is coming, and it will come sooner if we can all work together.

Alan Chambers (UUP, North Down)

I came across something on social media that caught my eye. It came from a doctor in the United States of America:

"We are the healthcare workers, are not your frontliners any longer. We are your LAST LINE OF DEFENCE. YOU, my fellow people, are the frontliners now. The war has shifted ... to the community and it is up to you. This cannot be won in the confines of the hospital."

Does the Minister agree that those are wise words that we all need to pay heed to and reflect in all our actions and, indeed, our words, especially those of us who serve in the House?

Robin Swann (UUP, North Antrim)

I thank the Member for his comment. I do not spend much time on social media at present, but that is an accurate message. We fight the virus now in our streets, in our shops and in our homes, where transmissions have taken place. As Health Minister, the ask that I make on behalf of our health service is the same as the ask that that doctor makes. If we encourage the people of Northern Ireland to come together and work together to break the chains of infection by following the messages that we have consistently put out of social distancing, good hand hygiene, good respiratory hygiene, wearing a face covering and reducing the number of contacts as much as possible, we can break the chains of infection that lead to hospital and ICU admissions. The message that that healthcare worker put out may have come from America, but I am sure that it will be echoed and replicated by any healthcare worker in any facility that is combating COVID-19.

Paula Bradshaw (Alliance, Belfast South)

From today, weekly testing of domiciliary care workers will begin in England. Is the Minister minded to replicate that in Northern Ireland?

Robin Swann (UUP, North Antrim)

As capacity increases with the mass-testing programme, we are considering that.

Jonathan Buckley (DUP, Upper Bann)

Please be assured that this question is not political but is, indeed, personal, as it is, I am sure, for many Members. The Minister's statement says:

"I do not want to have to look a grieving relative in the eye next year and say, 'Yes, we could've taken action before Christmas that would have saved your loved one’s life'."

Sadly, I found myself doing that this week not in relation to COVID but in relation to cancer. A GP from north Antrim wrote to me on Saturday saying:

"In our bid to manage COVID, we have unleashed a tsunami of other medical problems into what is already a crippled service. It is now broken, and I don't see how that can change as we tell our patients with potential cancer, 'I am sorry, it will be six months before you can see a consultant for diagnosis and treatment'. It gets to be a harder job every day."

What grieves me most is what has been missed during the lockdown period. The register for general quarterly statistics shows that cancer deaths to date are 3,490. Minister, can you update the House on the establishment of a regional cancer reset cell to oversee the resumption of cancer services to give patients some certainty in the days ahead?

Robin Swann (UUP, North Antrim)

I thank the Member for his question, and I know that it is in no way political. I received the same email. I am sure that the Member is well aware that I receive many emails from our healthcare professionals, from families and from individuals who find themselves in exactly the same situation.

While we are expanding and expending our health service resource on combating COVID, the challenges come in meeting the needs of non-COVID patients. That is why we published our surge plans and rebuilding plans and why we announced the cancer reset cell, which the Member rightly referred to, and discussed how that could approach how we deliver cancer services on a regional rather than simply a by-trust basis.

The work of that cell is ongoing on how we can bring together the operations, diagnostics and care pathways that were operating across trusts almost as silos. Although that is not the correct term, they were operating on a trust basis rather than across the whole of Northern Ireland. I will certainly be able to provide, which I look forward to, an update on the specifics of the outworkings of that cancer reset cell once I receive them. I do not have them with me today, but I will get them for the Member and will update the rest of the House on how that work is progressing.

It is crucial that we allow our healthcare staff to look after the patients of Northern Ireland and provide the care that they need. We can do that by ensuring that the staff do not have to look after more COVID patients and by following and abiding by the regulations that are coming forward from this Friday so that we can break those rates of transmission and many of our healthcare professionals can get back to work on their specialities and the areas of expertise that they trained for and we can provide the best healthcare system that we can.

The Member referred to the email that he received that talked about a crippled service. I do not disagree with it. Our health service has been under stress and strain for many years, but we have a number of things in place that will see it rebuild and rebuild better and not go back to the way it was. It would be a detriment if we allowed our health service simply to go back to where it was. That is why I welcomed, when we came back in January, the Executive's commitment that our health service would be a priority, as would not only the people who need it but the people who work in it.

Órlaithí Flynn (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

Go raibh maith agat to the Minister for today's statement. My question is similar to another Member's. The statement mentions the request that has been put in for four million rapid-testing devices. Will the Minister detail a bit more how the Department plans to roll those out? Are you thinking more about population-wide testing or about trying to target more high-risk groups like the care homes and meat plants etc?

Robin Swann (UUP, North Antrim)

I thank the Member for her question. The four million testing devices would allow us to do the entirety of the population. That would be a massive logistical challenge. This morning, I attended Queens University Belfast, which is running one of our first mass-testing initiatives. It has already been set up in the Whitla Hall. Its intention is to be able to do 6,000 tests per day by the end of the week, which is highly ambitious. That will allow us to work out what that will actually look like and how mass testing will deliver what we want it to. We have been involved at a departmental level in what has been happening in Liverpool and in the outworkings of that, where the wider mass testing of the population maybe is not just bringing forward the results that many would hope for.

In regard to the Member's question of whether we will be or are looking at more targeted interventions in mass testing, I will say that we are trying that initiative in one of our trusts and in care homes. We are putting those testing devices, while they are still limited in number and still new, to the best use and best purpose in order to identify those who are asymptomatic and those who are testing for COVID so that we can get the best support in place.

What I saw in Queen's this morning on that collaborative piece on mass testing was impressive in how it interacted with our test, trace and protect system so that a test positive case there, which can come forward in a matter of hours, was already being contacted by the test, trace and protect system to make sure that it is fully locked in to the entirety of our support programme.

Tom Buchanan (DUP, West Tyrone)

On the basis of the modelling that the health service uses, the restrictions in place over the past four weeks have not worked. The R factor has increased; not dropped to the level that was expected. What plans has the Minister in place should the R factor still sit at 0·8 or 0·9 at the end of the two-week lockdown that is being brought in? What plans does he have in place to ensure that there will be no further extension of the lockdown and that our businesses, and especially our churches, will be allowed to open? The closure of our churches is a retrograde step.

Robin Swann (UUP, North Antrim)

The Member makes the point about our four-week intervention not having completely the desired effect that we thought it would have. We saw a decrease in the first two or two and a half weeks, when schools were closed, but, unfortunately, when schools reopened, we saw that rate start to go back up. The Executive policy, as stated in a meeting in May, was to keep the R rate at or below 1, which means a continual decrease in the number of positive cases in Northern Ireland. The deciding factor for the Executive on Thursday was the number of hospital admissions. The severity and depth of the two-week intervention that we are bringing in on 27 November, which will take us through to December, should get us to a point at which the rates of transmission are being driven down and allowing our hospitals breathing space to enable them to discharge a number of the COVID patients who are already there.

As my statement referred to, the next steps are the forthcoming initiatives. The initiatives relating to mass testing are at an advanced stage. This morning, there was an announcement of another vaccine. That will be three vaccines approaching a level of effectiveness of between 70% and 90%. It is about such stages as those and asking the public to re-engage with us when these restrictions end on 11 December. They are time-limited to that date because of their severity. I thank my Executive colleagues for supporting the asks that were made, because they are dramatic and will have an effect on the public of Northern Ireland and our businesses.

Mr Speaker, you referred to an Executive announcement on support packages that will follow this statement. I look forward to that. I left the Executive meeting to come here. I hope that the support packages are as beneficial to the people and businesses of Northern Ireland as the BBC seems already to know they are.

Pat Sheehan (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

Gabhaim buíochas leis an Aire as an ráiteas seo ar maidin. I thank the Minister for his statement. The new restrictions are absolutely necessary. It is a pity that they were not implemented a bit sooner, but we are where we are. It is important that those who need financial support during these restrictions, receive it, and receive it quickly. In October, there was an announcement that £27 million would be made available to care homes for the care partnership arrangements. Will the Minister confirm that none of that funding has yet made its way to care homes?

Robin Swann (UUP, North Antrim)

I thank the Member for his question. I announced a new £27 million funding package for the care home sector. The funding was also to support care homes to continue paying staff at 80% of their salary when on sick leave for COVID-19-related reasons. That measure was first announced in June and then extended to the end of the 2021 financial year. The £27 million funding package is in addition to previously announced support packages, and it includes financial support for testing and visiting, to recognise some of the additional management time that is needed to respond to COVID-19. It is widely accepted that a fine balance had to be achieved on care home visiting. I am conscious of the extreme pressures on homes, but I do not want to see their doors totally closed to visits. I was hopeful that the new funding package would facilitate those visits, to the immense benefit of residents and their families.

The way that the funding package works is that expenditure can be claimed back by homes on a number of grounds, which include support for additional staffing because, for instance, there were more acutely unwell residents or there was a need to support individuals who were self-isolating, and also for block-booking of agency staff and continued enhanced cleaning support for changes to the physical environment, and that was to include the support for safe visiting. Trusts were provided with funds to administer applications to this fund in a regionally coordinated and consistent way. Work will be ongoing with the sector to ensure that there is clear guidance on what can be claimed and a streamlined and efficient process for administering the applications. It is about those care homes making claims to the trusts for expenditure that they have incurred, rather than an upfront payment.

Justin McNulty (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Newry and Armagh)

Thank you for your statement, Minister. I am really worried about the mental health implications of the restrictions for churchgoing congregations, publicans, business owners and their families. That said, Minister, what is the impact of the constant sniping from the sidelines by other Ministers and other parties about the decisions made in the House? It is very easy for us all to say that we are going to have a unified, positive message coming from the House. How difficult is that for the business owners who are on their knees and need help? It is easy for us up here; to quote another elected representative, we are all "well-heeled". How important is it that the grants are forthcoming quickly from the Department for the Economy and the Department of Finance to encourage adherence to the guidelines and restrictions?

Robin Swann (UUP, North Antrim)

I thank the Member for his statement. Look, unity, and unity of message, is important. We are united in having one enemy, and that is COVID-19. I have been consistent in my messaging and my position since I took up the role of Health Minister in this pandemic. Have there been opportunities where I could have scored political points? There have been many. Have I taken them? No, because I do not believe that that is how I, in this position, am best served in supporting the people of Northern Ireland who need healthcare, and in supporting our healthcare workers as well. I will say to the Member to be careful that he does not get drawn into the trap of others and criticise their political messaging and sniping by sending political messages and engaging in political sniping. It is too easy; it is far too easy. The difficult messages are the ones that we have repeated consistently about how we combat this virus: good social distancing, good hand hygiene, good respiratory hygiene, wearing face coverings and reducing the number of contacts that you have in a day and in a week. With regard to the financial support mechanisms for not just businesses but individuals, as the Speaker indicated, the Finance Minister will be making another statement to the House, and I will support him in that.

Roy Beggs (UUP, East Antrim)

Restrictions are put in place not only to help save lives but to protect non-COVID activity within the NHS. Minister, can you confirm that, as a result of the surge plan, non-COVID elected surgery has continued at a much higher level than previously, and that the public can play their part in ensuring that our Ambulance Service and accident and emergency units do not become overwhelmed so that, irrespective of what someone is suffering from, they can receive treatment from our hospital services?

Robin Swann (UUP, North Antrim)

I thank the Member. There was a question for urgent oral answer specifically on surge planning last week, when I addressed some of the misconceptions about the detail of work that has already been done by not just my Department but all six of our trusts, including our Ambulance Service. The point that the Member makes is the main one: while our hospital and care system is supporting COVID patients, those are beds, support mechanisms, specialists, specialities and skill sets that are being taken from elsewhere. To give the Member an indication of where we are with the work that our surge plans have done, I will compare where we were in October, as the last verified numbers, to where we were in April.

Under the three main headings of new outpatient activity, review outpatient activity and inpatient procedures and day-care activity, we conducted in the region of 57,000 procedures in April 2020. In October 2020, when we still had an increased number of COVID patients and increased support for them, the figure had gone up to 98,500. That is nearly 40% higher in those areas of expertise, while we were still looking after a high number of COVID patients, because of the work that was put in place by the Department, by the trusts and by individual care pathways to support their own patients while dealing with an increase in COVID patients.

William Humphrey (DUP, Belfast North)

The Minister is right: there are difficult decisions that all Ministers have to take on this hugely serious issue.

Apart from worship and prayer, many people attend church for solace and comfort. There is real anger and anxiety at the decision to close churches. Why was the decision taken to close churches despite steps taken by churches across Northern Ireland to purchase PPE and other equipment? What evidence was given for the closure?

Robin Swann (UUP, North Antrim)

As the Member will be fully aware, there are decisions that I do not take easily or lightly as Minister. In response to his specific question, we saw, through contact tracing, outbreaks and incidents that related specifically to churches. What was very clear in what our Chief Scientific Adviser and the Chief Medical Officer put forward was the data provided to our test, trace and protect system by those who had contracted COVID on where they had been. Those who attend church were more open and up front about where they had been. It was pointed out that there were a number of incidents involving churches.

I have had the conversation with the Chief Medical Officer and the Chief Scientific Adviser, and I am still supportive of reopening places of worship for acts of private worship, provided that social distancing and hard surface hygiene guidance is followed and face coverings are used. It is important at this time that people be given the opportunity to pray in private if that is their wish. The power of prayer is that it does not matter where it is done; it is the act itself and the belief in doing it that matter.

Liz Kimmins (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

I thank the Minister for his statement. The role of carers in our society was widely recognised and acknowledged pre-COVID and has been further emphasised throughout the pandemic. The restrictions have had an even bigger impact on support networks for carers, both on a statutory level and in their informal settings. That said, we have seen money provided for care homes and domiciliary care, as Members have mentioned. On the basis of that and the increased role that they have played throughout the pandemic, is the Minister considering a one-off grant payment for unpaid and informal carers?

Robin Swann (UUP, North Antrim)

I thank the Member for her question. The role of our carers has been highlighted many times in the House, not least by Ms Armstrong, who has been an advocate for carers, as have many other Members.

The advice document that was specifically developed for carers and young carers was first published on 10 April. Additional funding of £500,000 was provided to trusts via the Health and Social Care Board (HSCB) to allow for direct payment flexibility to be introduced, and that option is still there. We have not yet put in a bid for additional payments for carers or the support networks that have been asked for, but I am aware that the Minister for Communities has made specific bids for funding with regard to what the Minister of Finance may announce after this statement — I do not want to pre-empt anything — that would provide additional financial support for those in receipt of some benefits.

Kellie Armstrong (Alliance, Strangford)

It will not come as a surprise to the Health Minister when I ask him more about carers. I thank the previous Member for asking that question; I was going to ask it. Minister, I will say this to you clearly: carers across Northern Ireland, whether they receive extra payment or not, are exhausted, and I ask — plead with — you to go back to your trusts and ask them what supports will be made available over Christmas for carers, before we end up putting more pressure and more challenges on the health service due to the breakdown of older carers, most of whom are women. They are at breaking point. That is not an exaggeration. I have had people in tears who cannot cope any more; they are working 24/7 and are exhausted. Can you, please, confirm that something will be done with the trusts to make sure that there is equitable provision across Northern Ireland to support our carers in the run-up to and over Christmas?

Robin Swann (UUP, North Antrim)

I thank the Member. I know the passion and personal experience that she brings to this. I am fully aware of the challenges that our service users, carers and families face throughout the pandemic, and the Member has raised with me specifically the impact of the closure of day centres. She talks about equality across the region. Day-care centres provide valuable opportunities for people to reach their full potential, but they also provide respite for those with caring responsibilities. In July, the trusts restarted that day-care centre provision in line with the public health guidelines. However, the Member will be aware that there are significant barriers to restoring full-time provision because ensuring the safety of service users, families and carers is also paramount.

I appreciate the frustration felt in the House, by service users, by parents and by carers that day-centre provision is not yet available at the level at which it was accessible pre COVID to bring about that respite. My officials are working closely with the Health and Social Care Board and the trusts to identify ways to increase day-centre provision. In the interim, however, services are continually monitored and assessed so that service uptake is checked and the unfilled spaces are reallocated, where possible, as quickly as possible. Aligned to that process, trusts have been working with families and community colleagues to scope out additional and alternative supports, should that be from direct payments and domiciliary and the respite options. However, as I am sure the Member will appreciate, we can progress to full service in day centres only when it is safe to do so.

Paul Givan (DUP, Lagan Valley)

First, let me register an interest with family members who work in the National Health Service, and I pay tribute to those in the health service for the work that they are doing.

We all share the same objective of minimising the number of deaths, but there is a difference of opinion on how best we can do that. On the evening that the Executive announced further restrictions, a friend of mine who is responsible for hundreds of members of staff rang me to say that a vulnerable person in their employment who, they knew, was, because of isolation at home, vulnerable — they were putting in measures to assist — had taken her own life. They put that down to the lockdown measures. We all want to minimise deaths.

In reaching decisions on restricting people's movement and seeking to contain where they can go and what they can do, what analysis are the Executive and the Health Department, which leads the Executive on these policy decisions, doing of the behaviour of the public and how they respond? We all saw the scenes over the weekend of the queues outside multiple retailers across Northern Ireland and the spike in that contact as a result of the decision that was taken.

The decision that was taken on churches is putting people of faith into an impossible position where they are conflicted with their allegiance to an authority higher than civil authority. Is the Minister saying that he will continue to enforce lockdown and allow only solitary prayer as opposed to public acts of worship? My church, for instance, can easily accommodate —

Alex Maskey (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

Question, please.

Paul Givan (DUP, Lagan Valley)

— over 100 people with proper social distancing, and churches take that responsibility seriously. Is he saying that he will continue to recommend that those churches —

Alex Maskey (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

The Member needs to conclude.

Paul Givan (DUP, Lagan Valley)

— have to stay closed?

Robin Swann (UUP, North Antrim)

On the Member's last point and given the Executive's interaction, through the junior Ministers, with the leaders of the Churches, I think that they all recognise the responsibility that they have and the challenges that they have in following the advice and guidance on how we manage COVID. As the Member will know, they are not easy decisions for me or for the Member's colleagues in the Executive, where the conversations were had. It is not about restricting anyone's freedom to worship or pray, and I am disappointed that the Member would even try to put that allegation to me because it is not in keeping with me.

With regard to the analysis of behaviours, one thing that is increasingly challenging for my Department and the Executive is that there are those who seem intent on undermining our health message by their words or actions. Once you see that happening, it makes it harder for any individual to follow that advice and guidance in good faith. However, I welcome the statements from our Churches and religious leaders on the difficult decisions that have been made by the Executive as we once again try to bring the spread of COVID-19 under control.

Alex Maskey (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

Before I call the next Member to speak, I remind Members to keep your remarks very brief please and get to your question. We have a number of Members who wish to ask questions.

Daniel McCrossan (Social Democratic and Labour Party, West Tyrone)

I thank the Minister for his statement. Just briefly, I ask the Minister and Members of the House to join me in offering our condolences to the family of Bredge and Owen Ward, the husband and wife who died 12 hours apart last Wednesday as a result of the virus. It is completely devastating and a painful loss for the family and the entire community.

In relation to the restrictions in place, there is huge concern among the teaching profession and parents about schools remaining open. Given the spread of the virus and the need to take every possible step to prevent its spread now, in the mouth of Christmas, what conversations has the Minister had with the Minister of Education on the early closure of schools to ensure that we can enter the Christmas period as safely as possible and to ensure that teachers have a period of isolation prior to meeting with their loved ones, if possible?

Robin Swann (UUP, North Antrim)

We have all heard some of the heartbreaking stories about those who have lost their life due to COVID, and there are many other stories that we have not heard or seen that are equally tragic and hurtful to many a family who will have an empty chair or chairs around the table this Christmas. I pass on my condolences to all families who have lost loved ones. I have said before that the hardest reports that I have read and continue to read are the daily reports that give us the number of positive cases and deaths. Behind each of those numbers is an individual with a family.

An assessment has been made and a conversation has been had in the Executive on the importance of education and continuing our young people's education as much as it is practicable and safe to do so. One of the conversations has been around early intervention and bringing forward the school holidays by a week. One of the points that have been made and been listened to is that, when schools are closed, if there is no adequate provision for young people to interact, they could end up being in a worse situation when it comes to the spread of COVID than they would be in their places of education.

During the four weeks that we had, the only difference that we saw between the first two weeks and the second two weeks was the opening of schools, and I think that the Chief Scientific Adviser indicated that, where we saw the R rate increase, it was not solely attributable to what happened in classrooms but was associated with schools. That was part of our messaging. It was not just about the activities in the classroom or in the school building; it was about what happened at the school gate, what happened when transporting pupils to schools and what parents were doing when their children were in school.

There is an ongoing conversation. One of the decisions that the Executive have made is to prioritise young people's education. More non-pharmaceutical interventions have been suggested as means to allow education to continue in a safe and practical manner. My Department engages regularly with the Department of Education to bring forward and discuss those suggestions.

Robbie Butler (UUP, Lagan Valley)

I thank the Minister for his answers. Whilst it is, by no means, the only solution, advances in testing will play an important role in restricting the transmission of the virus. Can the Minister provide an update on Northern Ireland's participation in pilots of the new lateral flow tests?

Robin Swann (UUP, North Antrim)

I thank the Member. I touched on the issue earlier. I attended what is the first initiative in Northern Ireland, which is being rolled out by Queen's University. It will see its students and staff tested using the new devices. That is part of the programme of travel corridors that will allow students to return home for Christmas. While mass testing may be part of a solution, it is not the solution, nor should it be seen to be. A lot of work is ongoing. We have considered mass testing of the population, but we have to make sure that it is an appropriate use of those lateral flow devices when we receive them and with regard to the number that we receive. However, it is part of the armoury that we are now building up that will make 2021 a safer place.

Dolores Kelly (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Upper Bann)

I thank the Minister for his statement. I do not envy him his task. In his statement, he said that it is important to give people hope. What hope can the Minister and Executive give to the person who has recently received a devastating cancer diagnosis and been told by their cancer nurse, who had tears in her eyes, that no date could be given for any of their treatment to commence?

Robin Swann (UUP, North Antrim)

The message that I give is one of apology to that individual and many others across the community who cannot engage with the services that they need because we are supporting patients who are coming forward with COVID and need to be hospitalised due to clinical decisions and interventions. The challenge — it is not one of a message of hope, because that message would bring little comfort — to us all is to drive down the rate of infection and to break the chains of transmission, so that we can successfully reduce the number of COVID inpatients in the hospital system and people like the person whom the Member mentioned can be brought forward to see the specialists they need to see as quickly as possible.

Mark Durkan (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Foyle)

I thank the Minister for his statement and commend him on his efforts. Over the past few days, I have been inundated with concerns about the closure of gyms. The Minister will be well aware of the positive, essential role that exercise plays in the preservation and promotion of physical and, even more so, mental health. Can the Minister explain to the House and those anxious people the scientific rationale for the recommendation to close gyms, which have gone above and beyond to ensure that their premises and practices are sanitised and safe?

Robin Swann (UUP, North Antrim)

Again, I acknowledge the benefits that gyms provide. However — this is similar to a previous answer — through the test, trace and protect system, we saw outbreaks that were associated with gyms. That is why we took that decision and made the recommendation that gyms, too, close for the two-week period. I must stress to Members that it is for a two-week period while we reinforce that key, simple message to stay at home. That is the rationale that was taken. There is little point in a gym being open if the key message is to stay at home. There is still the availability of outdoor exercise that any individual can participate in. When it comes to what we could see through the test, trace and protect system, gyms were indicated as a source of infection. The steps that had been taken are commendable and had broken many a chain of infection, but we were still seeing a number of cases coming through.

Rachel Woods (Green, North Down)

I thank the Minister for coming to the House today. I also thank all those working in the NHS in dealing with the health of our population. As we know, not all heroes wear capes. There was mention of the opportunity for a better Christmas, yet, over the weekend, we heard from Professor Gabriel Scally, a public health expert at the University of Bristol, who said, on the Prime Minister's proposals, that there was no point in having a merry Christmas only to bury friends and relations in January and February. There seems to be some disconnect. When will details on Christmas be issued to the public? Will the Minister support the establishment of an expert task force to increase transparency and to take the politics out of decision-making on COVID-19?

Robin Swann (UUP, North Antrim)

I thank the Member for her two questions. The messaging on Christmas is being discussed with the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster, the First Minister and deputy First Minister, the First Minister of Scotland and the First Minister of Wales to ensure that there is a consistent approach. That conversation also involves the Chief Medical Officers to make sure that there is not a higher price to pay for what we do at Christmas. I look forward to that work concluding and a joint message coming forward. The Government of the Republic of Ireland are also included in that to ensure that there is consistency across these islands for all families.

The Member asked about bringing forward an independent task force to take over in order to take the politics out of decision-making. I know that many individuals are stepping forward to volunteer for that. However, I have always found that, when it comes to such positions, those who volunteer may not be the best people for the job, because they come with preconceived ideas that may not be of benefit. When such people were brought into either the health service, the Health and Social Care Board or the trusts, some of their ideas were not practicable or workable.

Jim Allister (Traditional Unionist Voice, North Antrim)

Last week, the Executive Office came to the House to make a statement; this week, the Health Minister has been sent. Is that because the Executive Office wants to keep its distance from the unpopular U-turns and the effect on business?

Can the Health Minister reconcile for me the return to lockdown with the fact that, from looking at the dashboard this morning, it is demonstrably clear that the number of COVID-positive tests is now half what it was six weeks ago, yet we are heading back into lockdown?

As for the Churches, did he even consult them? Does he understand — I am sure that he does — the hurt that has been caused? Will he publish the evidence so that they, too, can know why they are having to close, given that they tried so hard to do all that was asked of them?

Robin Swann (UUP, North Antrim)

I thank the Member for his three questions. In regard to the First Minister and deputy First Minister not wanting to be here in case they were tagged with an unpopular decision, one of the things that have become clear since I took up post is that it is not about trying to be popular; it is about trying to do what, I believe, is right not just for the people of Northern Ireland but for our healthcare workers.

The Member rightly indicates the fall in the number of positive cases. However, I encourage him to look on through the dashboard to the number of COVID-19 inpatients who are in our hospitals, and he will see that, since 9 November, that number has not fallen below 400. While that may sound like simply a number, to put it into perspective, I ask the Member to picture in the back of his mind an eight-bed ward, which, I am sure, he will be familiar with from visiting many friends and family in hospital, and then picture 50 such wards solely supporting COVID inpatients. That demonstrates the challenges that our health service faces in supporting not just COVID patients but all other patients.

With regard to the decision on churches, as the Member rightly indicated, it is not one that I recommended or brought forward easily. The Executive, the junior Ministers, the Chief Medical Officer and the Chief Scientific Adviser engaged with Church leaders after the decision was made about what is necessary and why it is necessary. As I indicated, the Church leaders have made statements. I would not say that they are fully supportive of the decision taken and the challenges that that brings, but they recognise that it was done in order to break the chains of infection.

Gerry Carroll (People Before Profit Alliance, Belfast West)

The Minister's statement indicated that mass testing will not be a magic bullet in the crisis as long as community transmission rises. I suppose that is true, but it is important to have a system of mass testing. Does the Minister therefore agree that, until now, the Executive have utterly failed to implement adequate testing and an adequate track-and-trace system when our R rate decreased? Have any lessons been learned as we peer into a two-week circuit breaker?

Robin Swann (UUP, North Antrim)

My answer to the Member's main question is no, because we made advances in our testing capability and in the ability of test, trace and protect. As for lessons learned, we have instigated a backward tracing programme in which our test, trace and protect individuals are now asked where they have been for the past seven days. That is an enhancement. We have also made technological advances with test, trace and protect so that those who test positive can interact by a text message or online and additional advice can be provided. Steps were taken during July and August to make sure that those systems were more robust.

With regard to the testing regime, by using pillar 1, pillar 2 and now mass testing through the lateral flow, we have an increased capacity that is meeting our current need.

Alex Maskey (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

That concludes questions on the statement. Could Members please take their ease for a moment or two?

Conor Murphy (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

I wish to provide Members with an update on the further allocations of COVID-19 support funding for the financial year 2020-21. I offer an apology for the statement being slightly late going into Members' pigeonholes, but, as Members will know, the Executive met this morning and ran on beyond 12.00 noon.

The COVID crisis has created a highly uncertain financial context. We have not known what course the virus would take or what the health experts would recommend in response to the virus, and we have not known how much money we would receive from the Treasury. That uncertainty has made financial planning difficult. The background to the allocations that I am announcing reflects that financial reality. Just over two weeks ago, Treasury provided a further £400 million to the Executive to support our response to COVID-19. I requested urgent proposals from Executive colleagues to use the funding to support businesses, public services and vulnerable people.

Some Members have asked why that funding was not disbursed immediately. Had we, as an Executive, allocated it immediately, we would not have been able to take into account the new restrictions agreed by the Executive last week. It was my view that it was right to have a plan in place to take us to the new year before making the allocations.

It has been argued that the financial package that I am announcing today should have been made at the same time as the new restrictions were agreed last Thursday. The first indication that I had of the restrictions being proposed was that Thursday morning. The proposed restrictions were discussed by the Executive throughout the day and agreed on Thursday night. It was only at that point that a financial package could be finalised, and my officials and officials in other Departments worked over the weekend to put it in place.

COVID is, first and foremost, a global health crisis. However, it has created a global economic crisis, and extensive support to businesses and workers has been provided to protect people's livelihoods. The extension of the current restrictions means that there is a requirement to extend the current support measures. An additional £55 million is being allocated to extend the localised restrictions support scheme operated by my Department. That will be expanded to include the non-essential retail, leisure and entertainment businesses that are required to close for two weeks. The Department for the Economy’s COVID restrictions business support schemes will also be extended.

I understand the frustrations of businesses at the speed at which payments are being made. It is important to understand that schemes that would usually be designed and implemented over many months are being turned around in days. Many Departments have repurposed themselves to provide grant support. Land and Property Services (LPS), for example, which is in my Department, is a rates collection agency. It has transformed itself into a grant-making agency and taken on new powers to do so. Similarly, the Department for Communities has stepped up to deliver a scheme for social enterprise and charities. The Department for Infrastructure has done likewise for taxi drivers. Designating a Department, devising a scheme, checking applications and issuing payments takes time, and we have a duty to minimise fraud and error. The grants are taking longer to issue than I had hoped, but officials are working as fast as they can to process payments.

Today, the Executive have agreed to provide a further £213 million of business support. The Executive provided a full year's rates holiday to the sectors worst affected by the pandemic: retail, hospitality, tourism, leisure, childcare and airports. I appreciate that those sectors will continue to suffer stress into the next financial year. I fully understand this, and my Department is considering options for how best to deliver further rates relief. Therefore, today, I am setting aside £150 million for that purpose while the work is completed as a matter of urgency.

A £95 million high street voucher scheme will give people a prepaid card for use on the high street, which has been devastated by COVID. The Department for the Economy is finalising the details of the scheme. Twenty million pounds has been provided for company directors, a group excluded from previous support. Twenty million pounds has been allocated to extend this financial year’s 12-month rates holiday to manufacturing businesses. That will bring the sector into line with what has already been offered to hospitality, tourism, leisure and retail. An allocation of £10·6 million has been made to what are known as "wet pubs". That will support approximately 1,000 licensed premises that are experiencing additional financial hardship as a result of the heath protection regulations. Five million pounds will top up the tourism and hospitality scheme, reflecting the extraordinary costs for some businesses that have been forced to close. There is £4·1 million for bed and breakfasts, which is aimed at approximately 953 certified accommodation businesses that were excluded from previous support because they paid domestic rates rather than business rates. There is £3 million for the extension of digital selling capability grants to help local businesses to grow their online sales. The allocations are in addition to the £60 million previously provided by the Department for the Economy-led COVID restrictions business support scheme.

The Department for Communities has been allocated £71·5 million, £44·3 million of which will enable a one-off heating payment of £200 to disabled people on higher rate allowances and older people in receipt of pension credit. That recognises the additional cost imposed on those vulnerable groups by the COVID-19 pandemic. It also includes a further £10 million each in support for councils and sport, £2·25 million for social enterprise support, which will allow the oversubscription to the social enterprise fund to be funded, and £5 million in respect of charitable grants, which will ensure that no charities are left unsupported for the remainder of this financial year.

The Department of Education has been allocated £20·6 million for COVID response measures and £5·8 million for COVID Education Restart measures. That includes vital funding to ensure that the families of young people who are entitled to free school meals will receive food grants during school holidays.

From the £10 million set aside for support for airports, the Department for Infrastructure has been allocated £1·2 million to provide further support to the City of Derry Airport. The Department has also been allocated £26·3 million in relation to lost income across it and its arm’s-length bodies.

Today’s allocations total £338·1 million. An additional £150 million has been set aside for the consideration of longer-term rate support, and a further £26·6 million is being held in reserve. Previously centrally held allocations, including £6 million for taxis, buses and coaches, £8·8 million for airports and £60 million for Department for the Economy-led schemes, remain pending. I will continue to keep the Assembly informed of funding for further measures as they are agreed.

Alex Maskey (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

I call Paul Frew. Sorry, I call the Chairperson, Steve Aiken.

Steve Aiken (UUP, South Antrim)

I rise as the Chairperson of the Finance Committee —.

Paul Frew (DUP, North Antrim)

For now

[Laughter.]

Steve Aiken (UUP, South Antrim)

You are not going to get it that easy. It is not going to happen.

I thank the Minister for meeting me earlier today and briefing me on the content of his statement before he came to the House. Minister, I thank you for your statement, and we welcome the much-needed funding as a means of supporting businesses. However, those businesses need the payments to be made without unnecessary delays. A number of businesses are still awaiting payments from previous announcements. Therefore, it would be helpful if you could outline what is being done to prioritise the payments for those still waiting and advise whether the applicable Departments have sufficient capacity to ensure that payments are progressed quickly. We note your comments about LPS and how quickly it has managed to repurpose itself. We also ask what commitments you can give to assure those who are eligible for support that payments will not be subject to undue delay.

Further to the announcement of the expected £95 million for the household voucher scheme, whilst it will provide a much-needed boost to local business, it would be helpful if you could outline the rationale for applying the scheme to every household, particularly as many of the households will probably not need it; whether a targeted scheme, offering a higher amount, would have been a more sensible approach to support those most in need; whether any households will be excluded; whether there will be an expiry date for vouchers; and what will happen to money from unspent vouchers. I am looking at the Department for Communities website, and there are 487,000 households in Northern Ireland. If it was approximately £100 each, it would equate to £48 million. Is it to be £200 rather than £100?

Conor Murphy (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

I thank the Chair for his comments and questions. Of course, the balance has always been between getting payment on the ground as quickly as possible and ensuring that — it is not two or three weeks since we had a debate in the Assembly about payments that had gone awry and the consequence of that. It was a very small proportion of the £10,000 and £25,000 grants, but it draws particular attention and reminds us of the necessity to ensure that public money goes to where it is designed to go to and gets to those most in need. It is a balance of getting payments out quickly. Also, the more focused or selective, if you like, the payment is, the more data is required to isolate it from other, broader groups to make sure that it gets to the right person. That data is not just the LPS data; other data can be required to verify that people are in certain businesses that are entitled to receive support. More focused restrictions from the Department of Health add complexities to the paying out of the schemes. We do not know what the Department of Health restrictions are until they arrive with us and the Executive agree to them. That said, we want to see the schemes get out as quickly as possible. They have been slower than I would have liked or the Executive or, I am sure, all MLAs would have liked. We will continue to encourage that. Certainly, the support scheme that LPS is rolling out has gathered pace and has started to pay out. LPS was well through those payments last Friday when I got the last figures. Obviously, we have been working on this over the weekend, but I will get up-to-date figures before Question Time tomorrow so I can advise Members where that is.

The voucher scheme is being operated by the Department for the Economy, which will, I am sure, expand on the detail as time goes on. It is not meant to support households; it is meant to stimulate the high street. The primary focus of it is to stimulate spending and growth on the high street and to give certainty to businesses. I am told that it is likely to roll out in the new year, because it takes about six weeks for such a scheme to be put in place. I believe that you are correct that it is about £200 per household, and it is intended to be sent out in the months when the high street is at its leanest — in January and February. It is really a stimulus to high-street spend rather than support to the household.

Paul Frew (DUP, North Antrim)

Minister, what use is the statement to the House when it is completely devoid of any realism and completely disconnected from the real world? What use is the statement to the single mother of three who runs a hairdressing salon and has not received one penny of support from you?

How much money did the Department for the Economy bid for, and what percentage of that bid has it received?

Conor Murphy (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

The scheme is designed to pay out to the sorts of people whom you reflect: those who own a hairdressing salon. If they have not already received money, they should be getting it in the very near future from Land and Property Services (LPS). Perhaps the Member can take the matter up with LPS rather than grandstand here in the Chamber. Most other MLAs are taking up individual cases and pressing them for people. The Member is saying that an allocation of almost half a billion pounds, when you add in the intent that I have for rates holidays to continue into the new financial year, is not to be living in the real world, but it is largely all of the money that the Executive have at their disposal to provide support. That is what we are doing. I understand the battles that are going on in your party. Those battles are affecting not only your party but the entire running of the Executive, because of the dysfunctionality that they cause.

[Interruption.]

We are trying to manage as best we can to get all those schemes done —

Alex Maskey (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

Order.

Conor Murphy (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

— to get support on the ground where it is needed and to get Executive decisions taken, and not only taken but supported by Ministers. All of that is a challenge, but we will meet it, regardless of what goes on in your party.

Maolíosa McHugh (Sinn Féin, West Tyrone)

Ba mhaith liom mo bhuíochas a ghabháil leis an Aire fosta as a ráiteas. Unlike the Member who spoke previously, I welcome the support measures that you have announced, and many other Members will welcome them. I appreciate the time constraints that you will have been subject to when drawing up the proposals and so on. Apart from the extension of rate relief and the £5 million that will be allocated to tourism and hospitality schemes, should travel agents in particular expect any further funding in the future?

Conor Murphy (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

It is perhaps not a case of providing further funding but a case of getting some support to them. I know that travel agents have been particularly badly hit. Not only have they lost business but deposits that they were paid have had to be paid back to some customers. I had a meeting just a few short weeks ago along with the First Minister and the deputy First Minister, at which we met representatives of their group. It was agreed that they would provide further information on their specific request for support that they want to see from the Executive. My officials have been engaging with them to collate that information and provide me with some guidance. Once that has been put together, it will be provided to the responsible Department to make sure that we can include travel agents in the support given. I am very keen to give them support if we can.

Matthew O'Toole (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast South)

I thank the Minister for his statement. Many of the measures are welcome. Critical for many of the people who are in extreme distress financially and, in many ways, emotionally as we head into Christmas, such as small business owners and people whom they employ, is getting the money out the door. I appreciate that that is the job of the Economy Department, which has, I am afraid, not been very fast at getting the support out. What assurances has the Minister had from the Economy Department that the support that is particularly aimed at some of those businesses will go out before Christmas so that people can spend it on some kind of Christmas for their family? That is absolutely essential.

People will want to understand more about the allocation of £95 million for high street vouchers. Is there is any prioritisation of small independent retail over some of the large multinationals? They have online operations, over to which some of their business has transferred. I ask for clarity on those two things: when money will go out the door and whether the £95 million makes any differentiation between independent and large-scale retail.

Conor Murphy (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

We, of course, want to get the money out the door as quickly as possible. I have encouraged other Departments' Ministers to make allocations to do that, not just the Department for the Economy's. There is a balance to be struck between trying to verify information to support a funding application and trying to ensure that the money goes out quickly. I encourage people who are applying to try to make sure that the details that they give are correct, that they are what is required and that they check in case there are return requests for details. Quite often, people miss emails that ask them to provide additional information. People need to keep a watch on that to assist in our getting the money out quickly, which we want to see happening as quickly as possible.

Some of the detail of how the voucher scheme is intended to operate will have to be expanded on by the Department for the Economy.

I appreciate what he says about the online presence favouring much bigger business. That is why there is a £3 million fund in this as well to assist local businesses to get more of an online presence so they can avail of that and that it is not just left to the big multinational companies. However, in terms of the target, and how much more can be spent, that is something that the Department for the Economy will have to respond to.

Andrew Muir (Alliance, North Down)

I thank the Minister for his statement. I welcome the actions taken to help some who are considered to be excluded, such as company directors and B&Bs. Will the Minister confirm that the £26·2 million held in reserve will be considered for those who are still excluded, such as the newly self-employed? Will the Minister consider allocating additional staff resources to ensure that the grant payments are made on time? We need resources to ensure that those payments are paid out to businesses.

Conor Murphy (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

The £20 million scheme is in addition to the £10 million for the self-employed scheme, which the Department for the Economy has already announced, so those things should be addressed. We are trying to provide additional resources. In my Department, Land and Property Services has a very specialised role; you cannot just put people into rate collection from other sections of the Department. However, we are trying to give them assistance with communication, answering questions and getting advice out to people. I hope that in other Departments, where speed is of the essence in getting support out on the ground, they provide additional resources to the teams that are working on it.

Alex Maskey (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

Before I call the next Member, I remind Members that they should not ask multiple questions because they eat up valuable time. Other Members want to ask questions of the Minister. I call Christopher Stalford.

Christopher Stalford (DUP, Belfast South)

This has become a pattern, Mr Speaker. The last time the House was warned about that, I was called.

Alex Maskey (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

Show leadership.

[Laughter.]

Christopher Stalford (DUP, Belfast South)

I have seen the annexe with the figure given for the Department for the Economy's allocation of £137·7 million. My colleague from North Antrim Mr Frew asked a question that was not answered. I ask the Minister: what was the total amount requested for the Department for the Economy?

Conor Murphy (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

The total request was in the region of £390 million, although I stand to be corrected. On top of the figure that you mentioned, there is an additional £60 million, which the Department for the Economy is holding.

Bear in mind that the Department of Finance is also paying out to businesses: there is an additional £55 million, which totals £90 million, which the Department of Finance is paying directly to businesses. It is not just the Department for the Economy that is paying out to businesses. The Department of Finance is paying £90 million, in the business support schemes that we are running, plus the £150 million that we have set aside. We were working closely with the Treasury over the weekend and hope to conclude negotiations very quickly. We hope to provide a rates holiday into the next financial year. That is also business support. It is not simply one Department that has responsibility for business support. A sizeable proportion of that business support function comes from the Department of Finance as well.

Of course, not all the bids can be met. We need to ensure, so that we can cope with bids, that they can be spent in this financial year. When Departments come forward with options, we have to be certain that they can be spent, as the last thing that we want to do is hand money back at the end of the financial year. That was the balance, and the Executive agreed to it.

Jemma Dolan (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

I thank the Minister for his statement. Some very welcome measures are being announced. How does the Minister intend to use the £150 million set aside for rates relief in the next financial year?

Conor Murphy (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

As I said in response to a previous question, this is one of the key issues that businesses have been pressing us on. We have had lots of engagement with business over the last weeks and months. Those that availed of the year-long rates holiday for this financial year have said how beneficial it was in ensuring that those bills were not an additional cost at a very challenging time. It offered some certainty in the new financial year and gave some early indication of that certainty. We have been trying to work on that, and I intend to use the £150 million for a further six-month rates holiday for those businesses that availed of the full-year rates holiday in this financial year. We are working with the Treasury on that, and I hope to be able to confirm it soon.

Gary Middleton (DUP, Foyle)

I thank the Minister for his statement. I particularly welcome the efficiencies brought forward by the Economy Minister, particularly the £95 million high street voucher scheme. That will be a great boost to our high streets. In saying that, the Minister will be aware that it falls significantly short of what was requested. When the details are confirmed for this scheme, will the Minister consider fully funding the request that was brought forward to ensure that we can recover as we come out of the pandemic?

Conor Murphy (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

As I said, it is a question of getting the right balance of packages. We are supporting businesses that have been closed down. The Department of Finance actually picks up the lion's share of the support because we are providing the scheme for the premises. The Department for the Economy's part is much smaller. It is the rate support scheme that will go on into the new financial year, the high street stimulus scheme and the voucher scheme that the Member has referred to. Of course, if we had more money, and if we do get more money, we can consider additional allocations to any of these schemes. However, it is a matter of trying to get that balance across a whole range of packages.

Sinéad Ennis (Sinn Féin, South Down)

I very much welcome the Minister's statement today. We now need to see every Department getting its finger out to ensure that payments get out to the people who are still waiting for the support that was promised to them.

Paul Givan (DUP, Lagan Valley)

It is Finance. Speak to your Minister.

Alex Maskey (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

Order.

Sinéad Ennis (Sinn Féin, South Down)

Thank you, Mr Speaker. Minister, B&Bs that pay domestic rates are now part of what has been termed the excluded group. Why was that group excluded, and what support can they expect in the package that you have put forward today?

Conor Murphy (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

As you have correctly said, B&Bs that have six bedrooms or fewer are classified as domestic properties and, therefore, were not able to avail themselves of the previous £10,000 and £25,000 support scheme grants. When we spoke to B&B owners, as part of the group that was excluded on a range of issues, they said that they could be identified through community information held by the Tourist Board, their certifying body. We were able to get that data and include B&Bs in the current scheme. So they will be paid during the current restrictions. We also recognise that B&Bs had previously missed out, and £4·6 million has been put into the scheme to assist them with the previously missed payment.

Pat Catney (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Lagan Valley)

Thank you for the statement, Minister. It was very detailed. I believe that it will go some way to taking some of the stress and heat from our business community.

Minister, you have allocated £10·6 million to wet pubs, and that is very welcome. I hope and trust that that will be rolled out as quickly as possible. I am sure that the Minister is also aware that there are public houses that have a rateable valuation of £50,000 and above. Is there a specific package to help those businesses?

Conor Murphy (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

As I say, the scheme for wet pubs is very welcome. I had pressed for a scheme for some time. In my own village, some pubs did not open again. Some pubs were only open for a number of weeks before they were closed again. They have been effectively closed down since March, so that scheme is very welcome. There should be a very clear list of those wet pubs and how to get funding to them. I hope that the scheme can be delivered to them very quickly.

The £10·6 million tourism initiative is aimed at properties and businesses with an NAV over £51,000 that missed out on the £25,000 grants. Of course, how that is allocated will be a matter for the Department for the Economy. However, that is intended to meet the needs of those premises.

Mike Nesbitt (UUP, Strangford)

I will be grateful for the Minister's assessment of what more might be done for businesses that are falling through the cracks. I was contacted by a business owner this morning who had missed out on the small business support scheme because they did not have a rates ID. However, they did not have a rates ID because it was a new business, and they did not get an assessment of rates in time. Will the Minister consider some sort of committee that might act as an appeals body to look at specific and exceptional circumstances like that?

Conor Murphy (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

I know that LPS has been trying to meet the process date to get the payments out very quickly and to deal with businesses that have submitted incorrect information or have a question over them. LPS has been trying to be flexible. On the £10,000 schemes, LPS is trying to be very flexible with businesses that had been in the process of getting valuations and assessments done and to allow space for that to happen. If the Member sends me the details, I will write to the Department and try to ensure that there is a follow-up. I know that they do come back to all those who missed out on the LPS schemes and try to work with them to see if they can be put on a scheme.

Gordon Dunne (DUP, North Down)

I thank the Minister for his statement. We all share the pain of those businesses, small or large, that are feeling the impact of COVID at this time. A set of bids was submitted by the Minister for the Economy, and they are detailed in your statement. It is very welcome that £20 million has been allocated to the manufacturing sector, and I understand that the money will be on top of any business relief. Will that funding run through until the new financial year that begins in April 2021?

Conor Murphy (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

The short answer is yes. It is to make up. That is another grant that comes out of the Department of Finance, as we manage the rates system, even though it is a support for the broad economy, not from the Department for the Economy. Yes, it is intended to allow the same rates holiday that other businesses have to the end of the financial year.

Caoimhe Archibald (Sinn Féin, East Londonderry)

Minister, thank you for your statement. I think that the point that you made to Mr Muir about the allocation of resources is an important one. There has been some lag time between the allocation of funds from you, as Finance Minister, and schemes being opened and delivered by, for example, the Economy Minister. It is important that resources are put in place to ensure that that happens as quickly as possible.

Is the £20 million that has been allocated for company directors in addition to previous announcements of allocations to the Department for the Economy, for example, for the newly self-employed?

Conor Murphy (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

Yes, it is. It is in addition to the £10 million that was previously given for the newly self-employed.

Kellie Armstrong (Alliance, Strangford)

Thank you very much, Minister, for your statement. Minister, the devil is in the detail, and there is a lot of information in your statement. I am particularly interested in the allocation to the Department for Communities, where the statement talks about a one-off heating payment of £200 to disabled people on higher rate allowances and older people in receipt of pension credit. I am sure that the detail will come, but do you know, at this stage, whether that is a payment per person or per household? We have many elderly carers who have not received an additional payment of carer's allowance throughout the pandemic. It will be interesting to see whether this, at long last, will be two payments in one household as opposed to just one.

Conor Murphy (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

I do not have that level of detail on whether it is a household or a person. Particularly with the pandemic, people will be spending much more time at home during the winter and, obviously, running up heating costs. The Communities Minister brought forward a proposal to help that group with its heating bills, and, obviously, I was very happy to support that, as were the Executive. I understand that the payment will be made in January, when the support is needed most, and I assume that the details on who will be eligible will be brought forward before then.

Paul Givan (DUP, Lagan Valley)

When I look at the allocations to the Communities, Economy, Education and Finance Departments, I see that they are all from requests to give money out to support people. However, the Department for Infrastructure has an allocation to shore up a failing Department, run by the SDLP. That party needs to focus, Finance Minister, on delivering for taxi drivers and getting people tested. Instead, it pontificates about and lectures others —

Alex Maskey (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

Order, Members.

Paul Givan (DUP, Lagan Valley)

— on their failings to run a Department. On the need to move forward and get this money out —

Alex Maskey (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

Order, Members.

Paul Givan (DUP, Lagan Valley)

— the Minister's colleague rebuked him about the need for the Department of Finance to pull its finger out and get the money. Will he ensure that his Department gets Land and Property Services to ensure that it gets this money out? How many applications are waiting to be processed? Will he give two thirds of the allocation to the Economy Minister, who is fighting for businesses?

Alex Maskey (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

Order, Members.

Conor Murphy (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

I am not sure where you get that. The Executive collectively have allocated about half a billion pounds, the lion's share of which is to support businesses across a range of Departments. To suggest that only the Economy Minister is fighting for businesses is a nonsense, and you should understand that. I know that you are making political points. The Department for Infrastructure bids were met in full. I encourage the Infrastructure Minister to get out the door the schemes that she is paying out as quickly as she possibly can, and I encourage the Economy Minister and other Ministers to do that too. Of course, the additional payments that we have offered up today are very welcome, and, when the payments are hitting the ground and the people out there who are suffering as a consequence of the pandemic are feeling the benefit, we will all find that we are in a much happier place. To be quite honest, I am not interested in the sideswipes and the arguments. I am interested in getting these schemes effectively out on the ground.

Karen Mullan (Sinn Féin, Foyle)

I also thank the Minister for his statement. I particularly welcome the free school meals payment that will apply across all the school holidays, and I commend all those who have worked and lobbied on the issue for many years. Minister, can you confirm for us the period that the free school meals payment will cover?

Conor Murphy (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

The money that we are allocating is COVID money, so it has to be spent in this financial year. The contribution that I have made for free school meals takes it up to the end of the financial year. Last Thursday, the Education Minister brought a paper to the Executive on the continuation of free schools until the end of the mandate, for which he got Executive support. That is very welcome. We are now working out the budgets for Departments and will have to work with Education to meet that budget, as the Executive have agreed, and we want to do it until the end of the mandate.

Sinéad McLaughlin (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Foyle)

Thank you, Minister, for your statement and for coming to the House today. I appreciate your acknowledgement of the delays in getting payments out, but those delays have very serious consequences. This morning, I got an email from a constituent. She wrote:

"I have applied for two grants. The first for our premises in the city centre and another one for the outskirts of the city".

She has received emails to say that payments would be on their way, but she has received absolutely nothing. That has gone on for seven weeks, not just a few days. Those payments have not been honoured for weeks. She wrote:

"Our landlords are putting us under immense pressure to get a payment to them or action will be started. This is quite worrying. We have maintenance to be carried out and the money simply is not there to facilitate it".

Alex Maskey (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

Will the Member get to a question, please?

Sinéad McLaughlin (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Foyle)

She continued:

"We have been in business for 15 years and I am considering closing my salons in January in the city centre".

Minister, what are you doing to ensure that your Department speeds up this process and gets money into this constituent's bank account as soon as possible?

Conor Murphy (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

We are encouraging LPS to act as quickly as possible. The data that it needs to assess close contact services was not possessed by it alone. A lot was possessed on the councils' environmental health side, so it had to get data transfer and match-ups. That is what caused the delay in the initial phase.

As I said — I am not suggesting that it is the case here — but, in general, if anyone comes back and says that they have not received payment, we need to make sure that the information is correct, it is in and people have responded to requests for further information. That can sometimes hold up a payment. Of course we recognise that people are suffering on the ground and want payments to happen as quickly as possible. We want to see that as well.

Justin McNulty (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Newry and Armagh)

I thank the Minister for his statement. Minister, I asked you about the number of payments made to applicants over the first four weeks of the restrictions. As of 13 November, 3,418 payments were made out of 11,589 applicants. That is less than 30%. Given that so many of the payments have not been made in the first tranche — the first four weeks of the restrictions — what confidence can you give to businesses that payments will be made this week? Businesses cannot wait. A Christmas tree has been erected in this Building, but I am not finding much cheer, and people —

Alex Maskey (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

A question, Mr McNulty. Thank you.

Justin McNulty (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Newry and Armagh)

— in business in my constituency of Newry and Armagh are not finding much cheer.

Conor Murphy (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

I do not have today's up-to-date figures because I was too busy over the weekend trying to distribute half a billion pounds right across economic and community support. I will get the up-to-date figures for tomorrow's Question Time, but the last up-to-date figures that I had at the weekend show a significant increase on the figure that the Member quotes, which is from over a week ago.

Rachel Woods (Green, North Down)

I thank the Minister for his statement. While he will be aware of businesses that have not received support payments weeks after they were promised them, he will also be aware that some have fallen through the gaps and have been unable to trade since March. Those people have received no financial help from the Executive. What discussions has the Minister had with the Minister for the Economy to make sure that there are no gaps and that the people who run those businesses get the financial support that they need? Do the new allocations fill those gaps?

Conor Murphy (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

I have said repeatedly at Executive meetings over the last while that there is a particular urgency in ensuring that the people to whom the Member referred who have received no support get support.

We are now into our second and third rounds of support for some businesses. While that support is clearly vital, it is grossly unfair on those who have not received it. I have met people from different sectors that are not the responsibility of my Department to try to offer assistance and steer them to the right place to get support, and to offer officials to assist them to gather up the right information so that they can take it to the relevant Department to present it and get support. I am keen to get support out. I am acutely aware that, as we roll out further levels of support for business, some people have still to receive it. I encourage those people to contact the relevant Departments to make their case. If they need assistance, I have always offered to meet people in order to steer them in the right direction, to encourage them and to tell them the type of information that they need to present to make a case for themselves.

Jim Allister (Traditional Unionist Voice, North Antrim)

Can I seek some clarification from the Minister about whether all of the £338 million that was today is Barnett consequential money from the Treasury, or is it supplemented by any savings that the Executive have made in various Departments? More specifically, what about Belfast International Airport? It is our primary airport, and it is now closed for a number of days each week. I see £1·2 million, again, for the City of Derry Airport, which must be the most over subsidised airport that we have. What about Belfast International Airport? Where is the money for it?

Conor Murphy (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

This is all Barnett consequential money. We used the October monitoring round savings to allocate to departmental pressures and to keep them separate from these allocations. Of course, I anticipate further surrenders of money in the January monitoring round, which will be used to meet some departmental pressures.

I intend to bring a paper to the Executive next week on airport funding. The Member may know that, when we made a previous payment to airports, the International Airport did not at that stage require any assistance from us. It is clear that it now does, and we are working through that with it. The payment that he refers to for City of Derry Airport is an outstanding payment; it is not new as part of this allocation. It is an outstanding payment that is coming from money that was held in reserves for the airports; it has been sitting in reserves for some time. Some £10 million was sitting in reserves for airports, and I hope by next week to be able to identify which Department is to pay that out — it will probably be Infrastructure — and work it through with Belfast International Airport, the City Airport and City of Derry Airport.

Gerry Carroll (People Before Profit Alliance, Belfast West)

The Minister stated:

"We have not known what course the virus would take or what the health experts would recommend in response to the virus".

I repeat:

"We have not known ... what the health experts would recommend in response to the virus".

Can the Minister seriously stand over that statement, knowing full well that, as an island, we saw the virus spread across other parts of the world and that his Executive were warned by health experts that reopening the economy too soon would risk a second surge? Is the Minister seriously saying, "Sure, we didn't know what would happen. It's not our fault. Nothing to see here. Move on"? Does the Minister think that that is acceptable?

Conor Murphy (Sinn Féin, Newry and Armagh)

I will give the Member the benefit of the doubt and say that he is misunderstanding what I said rather than deliberately misrepresenting it. Clearly, the criticisms that I was referring to and that he would have said had he gone on to quote further related to the people who were saying that we should have a financial package ready to go with the restriction announcements last Thursday. We did not know what the health experts were recommending with regard to non-essential retail until Thursday morning or 11.30 pm on Wednesday. For me, who goes to sleep at that time, it was Thursday morning. We were not aware of it, so we could not bring a financial package to the Executive on Thursday for agreement. As I said, I will give the Member the benefit of the doubt that he misunderstood that, but that is what I was referring to, not the global effect of the pandemic.

Alex Maskey (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

That concludes questions on the statement.

Matthew O'Toole (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Belfast South)

On a point of order, Mr Speaker. Can you advise whether it is in order for the Member for Lagan Valley to make pathetic and inaccurate statements about the Infrastructure Minister's handling of support schemes given that the Department reacted to the failure of the Economy Department to provide a support scheme for taxi drivers and the continued failure of that Department to provide support for a wide range of sectors? It is worth putting on record that the Infrastructure Minister got the legal powers and was able to get a scheme up and running within 10 days.

Alex Maskey (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

You will be aware that a number of comments were exchanged across the Chamber; you were involved in them. I will leave that matter for now.

The next item of business on the Order Paper is Question Time. I propose, therefore, by leave of the Assembly, to suspend the sitting until 2.00 pm.

The sitting was suspended at 1.53 pm and resumed at 2.00 pm.

(Mr Principal Deputy Speaker [Mr Stalford] in the Chair)

Oral Answers to Questions — Communities

Daniel McCrossan (Social Democratic and Labour Party, West Tyrone)

1. Mr McCrossan asked the Minister for Communities to outline the average success rate for a personal independence payment (PIP) appeal in the last 12 months. (AQO 1141/17-22)

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I thank the Member for his question. For the period of 1 April 2019 to 31 March 2020, there were 3,779 successful PIP appeals and 2,201 unsuccessful appeals. Therefore, 63% of PIP appeals were successful in 2019-20. For the period of 1 April 2020 to 31 October 2020, there were 104 successful PIP appeals and 133 unsuccessful appeals. Therefore, for the seven months up to 31 October, 44% of PIP appeals have been successful. As a result of the COVID-19 pandemic, no appeals were listed for hearing between 18 March 2020 and 6 July 2020. Since then, a limited number of appeals have been listed for hearing.

Daniel McCrossan (Social Democratic and Labour Party, West Tyrone)

Thank you, Minister, for the answer to that question. The significant rate of successful appeal shows the need for appeals to be heard as soon as possible, and certainly within a reasonable amount of time, yet there is a backlog of over 4,000 people waiting for their appeals to be heard — a problem that has predated the pandemic, Minister. How many appeals does the Minister expect will be heard by the end of the year?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I agree with the Member that there was a backlog prior to COVID and that COVID has not helped at all. I have asked officials to try to expedite ways in which people can have their appeals heard. Many people are not comfortable with a desktop review and are looking for telephony, should that be a video call or a phone call. Some have the opportunity for face-to-face, but it is important that we get not only the pre-COVID backlog addressed, but also the backlog since. I suspect that the figure that you have quoted has actually increased since that response was given.

Christopher Stalford (DUP, Belfast South)

Before I call the next Member, I welcome Ms Nicola Brogan to her place and wish her all the best in the House.

Nicola Brogan (Sinn Féin, West Tyrone)

Go raibh maith agat, a Phríomh-Leas-Cheann Comhairle; thank you. Minister, which of the different types of appeal available to claimants is the one most favoured by appellants?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I welcome the Member to the Assembly and wish her all the very best. The least favourite — also in response to Daniel McCrossan, as both of you share the same constituency — is probably the desktop. We are looking at video and telephone calls to try to assist people, because it is very stressful applying for this benefit, and it is even more stressful appealing it. We need to make sure that it is as smooth and stress-free as possible when people are applying for a PIP appeal.

Kellie Armstrong (Alliance, Strangford)

Minister, I am glad to hear you talking about an alternative to telephone as a means of communication. Videoconferencing would be very much welcomed for PIP assessments. I ask the Minister whether whatever system she is considering will be hearing-compatible for those with hearing impairments. Can those who are using this new type of system have someone with them? Quite a lot of people have had mental health issues due to the way that they have had to go through assessment so far.

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I completely agree with the Member on all of the points that she raised. If people are doing video calls and have hearing impairments, they should absolutely, under disability law, which should be human rights-compliant as strongly as possible, have an interpreter there, even for those who have difficulty communicating. The other aspect is that we need to make sure that, particularly as I said to Nicola, this process is as stress-free as possible, so I am looking at alternatives. I met the Participation and the Practice of Rights group (PPR) last week, and that was one of the issues that was on the human rights checklist that it is asking us to bring forward.

Andy Allen (UUP, Belfast East)

Minister, can you advise how many of the unsuccessful appeals went on to stage two appeals to the Social Security Commissioner? Also, do you have any data on how many of those within the backlog of appeals are currently in receipt of welfare supplementary payments? Can you give a guarantee that none of those payments will be impacted whilst they wait for their appeal to be heard?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I thank the Member for his three supplementary questions.

[Laughter.]

Fair play to you. I do not have the answers to the first two questions, but I will certainly get the Member the data that he has asked for. It is probably here somewhere, but it certainly did not jump out at me. I will get that response to you.

I have said this to others, but, as the Member will be aware from his constituency, going through the appeals process is very stressful. The last thing that we need is for people's stress levels to be increased, and we do not want the appeal to impact on other benefits and entitlements. We therefore need to make sure that it is done as smoothly as possible. That sounds like an easy thing to do, and it should be an easy thing to do, but the backlog is such that we need to tackle it head-on. We perhaps need to use this opportunity, if it is appropriate to call it that, to do things a bit differently and make sure that there are better outcomes for people who are waiting on good decisions.

Rachel Woods (Green, North Down)

The Minister will be aware that people are much more likely to get a PIP award if they have support from another person or from the independent advice sector. Will the Minister support a list of independent advice sector organisations or advice lines being sent out with the PIP form and the overturn rate for mandatory reconsiderations being made available in the information that is sent out on how best to challenge a decision so that more people can make more of an informed decision about whether to take the matter further?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I thank the Member for her question. That is certainly one of the issues that I am considering. It comes up time and time again from the independent advice sector, as well as from GPs, social workers, family support workers and a whole range of others. I absolutely will consider that, and, as I said to Kellie Armstrong, I think that it would be more human rights-compliant and more humane if that were allowed to happen.

Gerry Carroll (People Before Profit Alliance, Belfast West)

I was dealing with the case of a constituent who sadly passed away. My constituent was waiting for a long time on a PIP appeal and a PIP decision and got the award after having passed away. Minister, are you or your Department aware of how many people have tragically passed away from COVID whilst waiting on a PIP appeal or a PIP decision?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I am really sorry to hear that, Gerry. Pass my sympathies and thoughts on to the family. I am not aware of the answer, but, when I am asking for the data that Andy asked for, I will ask for that as well. The last thing that should happen is that someone's grief be compounded by a letter, either successful or unsuccessful, coming out after a loved one has passed.

Philip McGuigan (Sinn Féin, North Antrim)

2. Mr McGuigan asked the Minister for Communities when applications will open for the funding allocated to the sports sectors affected by the COVID-19 pandemic. (AQO 1142/17-22)

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I thank the Member for his question. In short, early next month is when we hope to have applications for funding open. Following a successful October monitoring round bid, I secured £15 million, and I am sure that the Member heard that I successfully got another £10 million on top of that. The aim of those funds is to ensure that the sports sector, which is representative of such a diverse range of interests right across our community, is not only sustained during the ongoing COVID period but supported.

My officials and Sport NI are working on developing programmes that will deliver a needs-based scheme to ensure that the funding is distributed fairly, with full transparency, to those who can evidence that the financial loss has been incurred as a result of the restrictions. I have met a lot of representatives of governing bodies and have spoken to a lot of clubs, and I am well aware of the financial impact that the COVID interventions have had on the sports sector. It is my intention to launch the fund as soon as possible.

Philip McGuigan (Sinn Féin, North Antrim)

I thank the Minister for her response. I welcome the news that applications for funding will open early next week. I also welcome the financial package that the Minister has agreed with the sporting bodies, her continued engagement with sports governing bodies across the North and, indeed, her engagement with local GAA clubs in my constituency recently. Given that she said that the money will be distributed fairly, can she provide assurances that the money that she has allocated will be accessible by grassroots sporting clubs?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

For clarity, the Member said "early next week", but I said "early next month".

Philip McGuigan (Sinn Féin, North Antrim)

No problem.

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

You are OK. I could see Members' body language change there, so cool your jets and give me a couple of weeks.

Yes, it is really important that the governing bodies, of which there are many, be supported, and it is certainly important that grassroots clubs be supported as well.

Across all sports, grassroots have been part of the first response during the pandemic and are still playing the role of lifeline to people, even though it is not their primary function. They have lost money as a result of the restrictions that we have placed on them. As we all know, in the charitable and voluntary sector, the ability to raise money through these months has been greatly hindered. Grassroots are well entitled to expect some share of the funding.

Chris Lyttle (Alliance, Belfast East)

I welcome the much-needed financial aid for sports. When might we expect a restart of grassroots youth sport? Will she be open to reviewing which sport can be included in the elite category?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

First, I am very conscious that many young people in particular have been prevented from getting involved in sports and training as a result of COVID-19 restrictions. I have no plans to review what is in the elite category unless the Member has specifics. Some of the correspondence that I have received from people asking for their sports to be categorised as elite will not fit the criteria, but that is not to say that the one that the Member has in mind will not. It may.

As the Member will be aware, I am working on the current health and scientific advice on the restrictions, and I have confidence. I spoke to the governing bodies and the clubs on the measures that they are taking, and I am keen to get youngsters and people like me, who are not so young, back out training.

Jonathan Buckley (DUP, Upper Bann)

The Minister will understand how critical it is to get funding out to sports clubs as soon as possible, and I welcome the announcement that that will happen at the end of this month or at the start of next. We know that COVID relief funding will not be enough to sustain a lot of clubs, given the serious pressures that they have. With that in mind, will the Minister give an update on the progress of the subregional sports stadia funding and the need to ensure a regional balance to that funding?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

There will be a regional balance to that funding. If you listen to some of the clubs in Belfast alone, you will hear that they have it all spent, so I give the Member that assurance. We are working through the business cases and all the outstanding items that we need to get it concluded before I bring it to the Department of Finance and, indeed, the rest of the Executive for approval. It is really important that people who live in the Member's constituency can expect to get some money.

The Member may be aware that, this morning, I received an additional £10 million for the sports hardship fund. That is £25 million in total, which, I am sure the Member will agree, will go a long way to help clubs that are struggling at this time.

Rachel Woods (Green, North Down)

3. Miss Woods asked the Minister for Communities what discussions she has had with the Minister of Finance on requirements for new social housing to be zero-carbon buildings. (AQO 1143/17-22)

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I have had extensive engagement with Minister Murphy, particularly on the future of social housing, and I welcome any changes to the construction of social housing if it results — hopefully, it will — in improvements to overall environmental standards. In the meantime, my officials continue to engage with DOF officials. For example, our officials are also represented on the development of DFE's new energy strategy and on DAERA's future generations group on climate change. As the Member will be aware, primary responsibility for introducing a requirement in building regulations for dwellings to be zero-carbon rests with the Department of Finance building standards. However, we are working collectively to have those regulations introduced after a public consultation.

Rachel Woods (Green, North Down)

I thank the Minister for her answer. In response to a question for written answer to my colleague Clare Bailey, the Minister of Finance indicated on 30 October that his Department was still consulting on technical documents relating to nearly zero energy requirements. What is the Minister's assessment of social housing being built without the relevant regulations and technical documents being in place in the Department of Finance?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

Certainly, I am on the record as looking at new construction methods. They will look at the best possible environmental standards. The documents that the Department of Finance is working through are quite technical. My understanding is that not only are they technical but there is a substantial volume of them. We want to do our best to get to them as part of the consultation, so that whatever changes are needed to the building control regulations will be done as soon as possible. I assure the Member that I will ask my officials, the Housing Executive and, indeed, housing associations to liaise closely and keep an eye out for the best possible standards. What we do not need is for new houses to be built that will have to be retrofitted a few years later. That is a waste of public money and people's patience.

Linda Dillon (Sinn Féin, Mid Ulster)

Can the Minister give the House some detail on the difference that it will make to the grant that housing associations get if they are able to achieve zero carbon?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I imagine that that will be part of the total cost indicator that housing associations and the Housing Executive will receive when they get to build. I will just double-check that. Certainly, if there is any increase in construction costs, as there may be, as a result of any improvements in building regulations, I would imagine that that would go into the total cost indicator. I will check that and get back to the Member in writing.

Mark Durkan (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Foyle)

Has the Minister assessed the adequacy of the housing fitness standard in providing high-quality, environmentally sustainable housing?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I will just let the Member know, through you, Mr Principal Deputy Speaker, that I have not made a final decision on that. However, with regard to the point that was raised by Rachel Woods in her question, that would almost be signing off on a fitness standard that is old and is not fit for the 21st century. As part of looking at the regulations, we will look at the fitness standards not just for the public sector but the private sector.

Paula Bradley (DUP, Belfast North)

I thank Rachel Woods for tabling her question. I absolutely agree with her sentiments on it. Right now, many homes in the social housing sector are not fit for purpose. They have damp, poor heating and no cavity wall insulation. Their carbon footprint is through the roof. Can anything be done about the homes that we have now?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

The Member will not be shocked when I say that at least 40,000 homes are in need of serious repair. I consider being able to live in a home without developing a respiratory disease to be a basic ask. That is part of the reason that I made the statement on the reconfiguration of the landlord side of the Housing Executive to a mutual or cooperative. The Member will also be aware, from her previous days in the Committee for Social Development, that the Savills report put it at a cost of at least £7·1 billion; I imagine that the figure is probably closer to £7·8 billion now. Homes need to be safe, clean, warm and dry. We also need to use the proper models, materials and tools to ensure not only that we reduce fuel poverty but that we achieve better health outcomes. For many people, particularly in our constituency, the level of respiratory disease is completely unacceptable.

Jemma Dolan (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

4. Ms Dolan asked the Minister for Communities for an update on a new library for Enniskillen. (AQO 1144/17-22)

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I thank the Member for her question. On 14 August 2020, my Department approved the outline business case for the redevelopment of Enniskillen library on the existing site at Halls Lane in Enniskillen. While the project is at an early stage, my Department has already allocated £150,000 in this financial year to Libraries NI to allow it to advance the project to the design and procurement phase. I can also confirm that a design team has been appointed to progress the concept design and the necessary feasibility studies and develop the design for the project. The construction of the new library has been projected to require an investment of £4·5 million. The estimated completion date is 2023.

Jemma Dolan (Sinn Féin, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

I thank the Minister for that welcome news. I am sure that we will have some happy people in Fermanagh. Can I invite the Minister to come and visit the library when it is safe to do so?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

Certainly. During my previous days in DCAL, I visited quite a few libraries in the Member's constituency. I am delighted to see that the library is receiving the support that it needs, because I can remember, from 2012 and 2013, that it needed support.

When the restrictions are lifted and when the time is appropriate, I will be more than happy to visit the Member's constituency and that library.

Rosemary Barton (UUP, Fermanagh and South Tyrone)

Minister, now that you are on the issue of libraries in Fermanagh and South Tyrone, can I ask for an update on Fivemiletown library?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I thank the Member for her question. I do not have information on that library, but I will get that to her in writing. I should have anticipated a question on at least one library in every constituency. That library was not on the list, so apologies for that.

Gerry Kelly (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

5. Mr G Kelly asked the Minister for Communities when ring-fencing of new-build social housing, as outlined in her statement on housing policy, will come into effect. (AQO 1145/17-22)

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I thank the Member for his question. I am currently considering a range of options to increase the supply of social housing to address demand. A key element of that plan will be to ring-fence and weight the social housing development programme's output so that it is better at providing new social homes in greater numbers in the areas of most need. My officials and the Housing Executive are progressing that work. It is my intention to see the ambition of ring-fencing reflected in the new three-year programme that will be submitted to me in January 2021.

Gerry Kelly (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

Gabhaim buíochas leis an Aire as a freagra go dtí seo. I thank the Minister for her answers up to now. My supplementary question has, to a great extent, been answered. It was about when we will see the beginning of the changes that were promised in the very welcome statement that she made.

The Minister will be aware of damage done to Housing Executive premises in Ardoyne caused by a faulty shower unit. Is there an investigation of that, especially given that, as I understand it, those shower units were on a recall list from 2018? My worry is that we may have a huge problem in social housing throughout the North.

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I thank the Member for his question. I saw some media reports about that, prompted, I am sure, by the Member. It is very worrying if it is the case that those shower units were recalled in 2018 and a fire has subsequently happened in a home. Certainly, I await the outcome of the initial investigation. To assure you and, indeed, other Members, I will ask whether there were recalls in any other constituency and what has been done since. That is a fairly credible question to ask. If the advice that I get flags up concerns, I will share that with Members.

Paula Bradley (DUP, Belfast North)

North Belfast, as we know, will be one of the ring-fenced areas. Minister, when you look at the policy, will you look at North Belfast in its entirety, because, quite often, Newtownabbey is left out of the social housing figures when it comes to reflecting the demand in North Belfast? Can the Minister give me an assurance that Newtownabbey will also be taken into account?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I thank the Member for her question. I will look at the geographical area, but I can certainly talk to officials to ensure that that is the case. There is need in all constituencies. When the details on the policy's progress come back, I will look to see which areas are covered. As the Member will be aware, the issue for me is that, every year, the number of people in acute housing stress grows by 1,000. There are unacceptable levels across — it is right across — the constituency. I will wait to see what I am presented with, but I assure the Member that, if Newtownabbey is not there, I will certainly ask about that.

Mark Durkan (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Foyle)

Does the Minister recognise the importance of enshrining flexibility in the reintroduced ring-fencing policy? When the policy existed before, the Housing Executive demonstrated that it did not have sufficient flexibility, which impacted negatively on social housing provision inside and outside ring-fenced areas.

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I thank the Member for his question. He is absolutely right. I remember when the policy was removed and the consultation on it. Let me be clear: I expect the Housing Executive to present me with proposals that look at the areas most in need. The Member's constituency is, unfortunately for him and for everybody else, at the top of that list, and that has persistently been the case. We need to look at ways to tackle that. A one-size-fits-all approach will not work. We need flexibilities or even the ability to contract in and out because it needs to reflect the true need and have an outcome for those on the waiting list.

Kellie Armstrong (Alliance, Strangford)

Ring-fencing new-build social housing will mean that opportunities for builders will increase fantastically. However, there is an issue about the number of apprentices and younger people going into the industry. Is the Minister working with the Department for the Economy and the Department of Education to identify opportunities so that more people can be brought into the workforce?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

When the proposals come back, I will talk to other Departments. I want to go further to ensure that the way in which procurement happens is not open to as much challenge. Even current Housing Executive contracts are challenged at a low rate, which holds back procurement and contracts. I want to make sure that it is done as part of any contract, so social clauses, social benefits and social value need to be built in at the start and completion of a project — not for just a couple of weeks here and there — so that apprentices are fully supported from the day and hour that they walk in to the day and hour that they leave, hopefully with a trade.

In relation to the question from Rachel Woods, I hope that there will be an opportunity for new ways of construction. That is a new market not only for current tradespeople but for new and prospective tradespeople.

Andy Allen (UUP, Belfast East)

Minister, in the past 10 years, we have been in and around meeting the target for social housing starts. As we discussed in Committee, however, that is clearly not having the effect that is required to house the many thousands on the waiting list across the Province. I appreciate that part of your revitalisation is to increase the number of houses. Are you able to indicate at this stage what a more realistic and ambitious target of new housing starts will be?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

Even through the Programme for Government negotiations before this place was brought back, I think that every party wanted the Programme for Government to have a housing indication and, within that, better housing targets.

I have given a policy direction. At the end of January, I will have proposals not just on tackling the ring-fencing but on increasing the number of housing starts. I think that the target was met one year, and that is not acceptable.

Roy Beggs (UUP, East Antrim)

6. Mr Beggs asked the Minister for Communities for an update on the support and funding her Department is offering to those performing artists and tutors who continue to be excluded from other support schemes. (AQO 1146/17-22)

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I thank the Member for his question. From my contact with people across the arts and culture sector, I understand the impact that the restrictions are having on their ability to make a living and the need to continue to provide support to individuals and organisations. As part of a wider package of measures to support the culture, arts and heritage sectors, the Arts Council, on my behalf and that of my Department, has delivered two rounds of funding to individuals working across the arts and creative sectors. The artists' emergency programme was open for applications from 27 April to mid-May, with payments made in May and June. The individual emergency resilience programme was open for applications from 31 July to 17 August, and offers of grant were issued in October. The two programmes have resulted in grant awards totalling £4,400,000 to over 1,300 individuals. I will shortly make an announcement on further programmes to support individuals, and it continues to be my intention that those should be available to as wide a range as possible across the arts and creative sectors.

Roy Beggs (UUP, East Antrim)

Many music and drama tutors operate from home, are usually self-employed and have been unable to benefit from the furlough scheme. I am aware of a highly successful local arts company that established itself as a company to minimise its tax liability. It has had no income since February. Will the new scheme to which the Minister refers include those who have been excluded to date, or will they, perhaps, have to rely on schemes that the Finance Minister might bring out?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

A lot of companies that previously may have gone to the Arts Council got support from, for example, the Department for the Economy and some from the Department of Finance, particularly for rates.

However, the issue for me is that a lot of people who are self-employed have not had access to any public funds, and that is a problem. I encourage the Member to encourage companies and individuals like that to apply to the Arts Council, because that is exactly the sort of support that we are trying to get out, particularly for people who have not had access to any public funds, who may not be eligible to universal credit or anything else and who, in the run-up to Christmas, have been put under additional pressure by not knowing where they will get support from.

Christopher Stalford (DUP, Belfast South)

Thank you, Members. That ends the period for listed questions. We now move on to 15 minutes of topical questions.

Maurice Bradley (DUP, East Londonderry)

T1. Mr M Bradley asked the Minister for Communities what guidance she has given the Arts Council about the fund for musical instruments, which is due to close today, in light of the Committee for Communities supporting the forwarding of a letter seeking an extension of the fund. (AQT 701/17-22)

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I have not seen the letter yet, but I am happy to look at it. When I do, I will decide whether to reissue guidance to the Arts Council or ask whether it could extend the fund. As the Member will also be aware, even the Ulster-Scots Agency has access to musical instruments, particularly for bands. It is really important, particularly when people are self-isolating and trying to do tutorials over the internet, that they are given access to instruments to teach with.

Maurice Bradley (DUP, East Londonderry)

Why was that funding open for only 17 days? Many bands have been unable to have meetings, practices or any sort of committee meeting to apply for the funding. Will it be open again for further applications?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

To give the Member assurance, I was not aware that it was open for only 17 days, so I make a commitment to him that I will find out what the criteria were, how long it was opened for, what notification the Arts Council gave, and then, if there is the need for an extension, I will talk to the Arts Council about how it can happen. I do not want anybody to fall out of the loop here, particularly if they can use their skills and expertise to help others, especially during COVID.

Christopher Stalford (DUP, Belfast South)

As a point of housekeeping, I should say that question 5 has been withdrawn.

Paul Frew (DUP, North Antrim)

T2. Mr Frew asked the Minister for Communities why she is failing the most vulnerable in society because people have to make appeals, which can be horrendous, about personal independence payment or employment and support allowance (ESA) by phone and because the Kickstart programme has not been commenced. (AQT 702/17-22)

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I will take the Member's last question first. First of all, it is not my intention to fail anybody. I just want the Member to accept that.

Paul Frew (DUP, North Antrim)

You are.

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I am not, so I respectfully disagree.

The Kickstart scheme will not be introduced this month, because we are not calling it "Kickstart"; we are callling it "Jobstart". It will be far better than what the British Government in England introduced. It will be a bespoke programme, and, if I introduced it, it would be done during a two-week lockdown. I do not want that to happen, because, as soon as it is introduced, the clock starts ticking.

With regard to PIP, if the Member had been here — I appreciate that we have to do a skeleton rota because of the restrictions — he would have heard me say — I will repeat it for him — that I am not happy with people just being given the opportunity to talk about their appeals over the phone; I want other avenues to be made available to them. People have said that they prefer that to happen by desktop, phone or videoconferencing. Again, I do not accept that I am deliberately failing anyone. If there are things that I could do better, I am happy to look at them, but I ask the Member to reconsider that.

Paul Frew (DUP, North Antrim)

I assure the Minister that she is failing people when she cannot use two decent side rooms in Ballymena to have oral hearings for PIP and ESA. A laptop or a desktop will just not cut it, Minister, when you have vulnerable people who are not able to speak or to address other people across the phone or through computer technology. You are failing in that regard, Minister.

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I will certainly ask officials what happened in the Member's constituency. He can rest assured that I will do everything that I can to ensure that people have a fair hearing, because that is what it is about. I do not stand over anything that did not work or caused more stress. To be fair, the officials in my Department do not want that either, so something is not working. There is a massive backlog, and we need to fix it. We need to fix it so that people who are already going through a stressful situation are not put under additional stress, particularly given that the benefit is for people who need it most. That is my commitment.

Pat Sheehan (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

T3. Mr Sheehan asked the Minister for Communities what matters she is considering to increase capacity in the social housing development programme to better target areas where there is acute need for such housing. (AQT 703/17-22)

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I thank the Member for his question. He will be aware of the statement that was made here some time ago. Across the North, the need is growing, and it has been growing exponentially every year. For people who live in acute housing need or what is described as "housing stress", that is completely unacceptable. That is why I introduced ring-fencing. That is just one example, but there are many other ways in which we need to tackle this. I am in discussions and will advance those discussions with housing association and Housing Executive colleagues, as well as councils, to see what land we can develop collectively as part of the local development plans. Then, we need to get houses that are fit for purpose and meet the needs of people in the area where they live. Those are some of the ways in which we hope to address the acute housing shortage.

Pat Sheehan (Sinn Féin, Belfast West)

Gabhaim buíochas leis an Aire as ucht a freagra. I thank the Minister for her answer. Will she tell us what areas have been identified as having the highest need?

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

Mark Durkan is still here, and his constituency, Foyle, has the highest need, followed by North Belfast and West Belfast. Going back decades, those areas have had the highest need. That is why those areas need to be ring-fenced, and we need to have ambitious plans to reduce the stress that people live in, as well as future-proofing all of this for future generations. It is clear, not only anecdotally but evidentially, that, because the supply is not there and has not been there to meet demand, we need to start lifting the curve. The only way to do that is through proposals that address it head-on and look for opportunities for land development, particularly in areas of housing need. I believe that, up to now, that has not been the case.

Justin McNulty (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Newry and Armagh)

T4. Mr McNulty asked the Minister for Communities how and when the £25 million that her Department has, which comprises £15 million already allocated to combat sports hardship and £10 million announced by the Finance Minister today, will be spent, particularly as sports clubs and organisations need that money now as opposed to next February or March. (AQT 704/17-22)

Carál Ní Chuilín (Sinn Féin, Belfast North)

I agree with the Member. I am aware that, at a recent meeting with Sport NI, governing bodies were told that they would not get any money until, perhaps, the end of March, which sent everybody off in a spin. My intention is that, certainly early next month, those applications will open. I also welcome the additional £10 million that Conor Murphy has given, because it is clear that, without even getting down to the grassroots clubs, the governing bodies could have spent that £15 million themselves. We need to make sure that the money addresses the losses that people have now from a big governing body right down to a small grassroots club with a handful of people. It is important that they all get some money.

Justin McNulty (Social Democratic and Labour Party, Newry and Armagh)

Minister, I have been contacted by numerous gym owners over the weekend. All are concerned about the closure of their gyms and the impact on their clients physically and mentally. Does the Minister share my view that gyms should be kept open with strict social-distancing guidelines from the perspective of mental and physical health?

Will the Minister indulge me, please, by applauding the achievements and success of Cavan and Tipperary at the weekend? It is extraordinary that Cavan won its first Ulster title in many years and Tipperary its first Munster title in 85 years. It is an extraordinary coincidence that, in1920 and in 2020 — 100 years after Bloody Sunday — the same four teams were in the semi-finals of the All-Ireland.